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zombie
I have to look up suicide for English and I was wondering what you people thought about it.

More 2 the point what do you think about this.
Four out of five teenagers who successfully commit suicide are male, but the average female teenager is four times more prone to attempt suicide during her teen years than the average male.
Lobotomized Spleen
I think any failed suicide attempt (I'm using that pretty loosely. There will always be people who screw up and jump off a building that isn't quite high enough, so instead of ending up dead they end up with brain damage, etc.) is a call for help.
If someone wants to die, they die.
I think women are more driven by emotion then men, causing more of them to attempt suicide.

And as far as I'm concerned, a person is the owner of their life. If they want to kill themselves then that's their choice. It pains me that anyone ever wants to kill themselves, but in this world it can't be helped.
It annoys me to no end when someone says that suicide is a coward's way out. I wonder if the person who says something like that has ever seriously thought about killing themself. Killing yourself is an act that plunges you deep into the unknown, and there is nothing more frightening, in my opinion, then the unknown. It takes quite a bit of courage to kill yourself.

Then there are people who say things like "John shouldn't have killed himself over his girlfriend leaving him, I would be able to get through that". But that person isn't John. That person does not have the same exact make up and emotional weaknesses that John had.
What seems like absolutely nothing to you could cause another to be pushed over the edge. Don't judge others using yourself as the measuring stick. Doing that is not only egoistical, it's flawed.

Those are my thoughts. smile.gif
Smoke Alchemist
What do i think about it? Well first off i do know someone who died a few weeks ago by taking his own life. It was a co-worker of mine and while i did not know him very well i know the first thing i thought of was why? Did he think no one loved him? did he think tomorrow wouldn't get any better? I just think when you are in that state of mind you need help obviously, someone who you can talk to that will listen.

Sidenote here: the way i found out this person commited suicide is when i heard 2 other co-workers joking about it...and one actually said "Who cares" and i kind of cringed a little and thought Geez, maybe that is why this poor man commited suicide, thoughts just like that. sad.gif
zombie
QUOTE
the way i found out this person commited suicide is when i heard 2 other co-workers joking about it...and one actually said "Who cares"

That's SICK. Why on earth would someone sat something like that?
Smoke Alchemist
Believe me i said something about it. It made them feel like more then the jerks they are.
Chiyo
hmm, sensitive topic here.

Well I know someone who found her mother after she had commited suicide and as you can guess she hasn't been the same since. In cases like this I think suicide is a very selfish thing to do. They go on about no-body caring about them but most of the time they just don't realise how many people do. People with children do their children so much mental damage by taking their own lives.

Those who attention seek are obviously desperate, otherwise they'd attention seek by self harming. Sometimes it can go wrong and they really do end up killing themselves when they didn't intend to.

However when the real sick bastards who are banged up for life kill themselves I really don't care. They have no life as they are in prison anyway. And I don't mean petty crimes I mean the really disturbed people.
Toby-Chan
My friend attempted suicide last week and was found just before he died. He's been braindead, and we've all been on emotional pins and needles about the subject since he was on life support, but somehow I think in the back of my mind I believed he would get out of it, and I could at least see him, or he could hear me, or we could make some sort of sense out of it. They pulled the life support and he died last night.

It just dosen't make any f***ing sense.
Mrs. Edward Elric
QUOTE(Toby-Chan @ Nov 23 2005, 12:19 PM) [snapback]318709[/snapback]

My friend attempted suicide last week and was found just before he died. He's been braindead, and we've all been on emotional pins and needles about the subject since he was on life support, but somehow I think in the back of my mind I believed he would get out of it, and I could at least see him, or he could hear me, or we could make some sort of sense out of it. They pulled the life support and he died last night.

It just dosen't make any f***ing sense.


Why did they pull out the life support? Was it his parent's decision? How did he become braindead? How did he attempt suicide?
The RZA
I just hope his family, friends & Toby-Chan can overcome this.
Toby-Chan
QUOTE(Mrs. Edward Elric @ Nov 23 2005, 12:31 PM) [snapback]318710[/snapback]

QUOTE(Toby-Chan @ Nov 23 2005, 12:19 PM) [snapback]318709[/snapback]

My friend attempted suicide last week and was found just before he died. He's been braindead, and we've all been on emotional pins and needles about the subject since he was on life support, but somehow I think in the back of my mind I believed he would get out of it, and I could at least see him, or he could hear me, or we could make some sort of sense out of it. They pulled the life support and he died last night.

It just dosen't make any f***ing sense.


Why did they pull out the life support? Was it his parent's decision? How did he become braindead? How did he attempt suicide?


His parents chose. I have no idea how he did it, because it's so hard to get news about him; his parents were being all secretive and didn't even want the teachers to talk about it.

I... I just don't even know anything and it's driving me nuts.
Mrs. Edward Elric
Here's an excerpt one of my friends sent to me. Take it into consideration.

:.:.:.:.:.:.:.:.:.:.:.:.:.:.:.:.:.:.:.:.:.:.:.:.:.:.:.:.:.:.:.:.:.:.:.:.:.:.:.:.:.:.:.:.:.:.:.:.:.:.:.:.:.:.:.:.:.:.:.:.:.:.:

Saving a person's life unknowingly

One day, when I was a freshman in high school,

I saw a kid from my class was walking home from school.

His name was Kyle.

It looked like he was carrying all of his
books.

I thought to myself, "Why would anyone bring home all his books on a Friday?

He must really be a nerd."

I had quite a weekend planned (parties and a football game with my friends tomorrow afternoon), so I shrugged my shoulders and went on.

As I was walking, I saw a bunch of kids running toward him.

They ran at him, knocking all his books out of his arms and tripping him so he landed in the dirt.

His glasses went flying, and I saw them land in the grass about ten feet from him.

He looked up and I saw this terrible sadness in his eyes.

My heart went out to him. So, I jogged over to him and as he crawled around looking for his glasses, and I saw a tear in his eye.

As I handed him his glasses, I said, "Those guys are jerks.

They really should get lives.

" He looked at me and said, "Hey thanks!"

There was a big smile on his face.

It was one of those smiles that showed real gratitude.

I helped him pick up his books, and asked him where he lived.

As it turned out, he lived near me, so I asked him why I had never seen him before.

He said he had gone to private school before now.

I would have never hung out with a private school kid before.

We talked all the way home, and I carried some of his books.

He turned out to be a pretty cool kid.

I asked him if he wanted to play a little football with my friends.

He said yes.

We hung out all weekend and the more I got to know Kyle, the more I liked him, and my friends thought the same of him.

Monday morning came, and there was Kyle with the huge stack of books again.

I stopped him and said, "Boy, you are gonna really build some serious muscles with this pile of books everyday!

" He just laughed and handed me half the books.

Over the next four years, Kyle and I became best friends

When we were seniors, we began to think
about college.

Kyle decided on Georgetown, and I
was going to Duke.

I knew that we would always be friends, that the miles would never be a problem.

He was going to be a doctor, and I was going for business on a football scholarship.

Kyle was valedictorian of our class.

I teased him all the time about being a nerd.

He had to prepare a speech for graduation.

I was so glad it wasn't me having to get up there and speak.

Graduation day, I saw Kyle.

He looked great.

He was one of those guys that really found himself during high school.

He filled out and actually looked good in glasses.

He had more dates than I had and all the girls loved him.

Boy, sometimes I was jealous.

Today was one of those days.

I could see that he was nervous about his speech.

So, I smacked him on the back and said, "Hey, big guy, you'll be great!"

He looked at me with one of those looks (the really grateful one) and smiled.

"Thanks," he said.

As he started his speech, he cleared his throat, and began.

"Graduation is a time to thank those who helped you make it through those tough years.

Your parents, your teachers, your siblings, maybe a coach...but mostly your friends...

I am here to tell all of you that being a
friend to someone is the best gift you can give them.

I am going to tell you a story."

I just looked at my friend with disbelief as he told the story of the first day we met.

He had planned to kill himself over the weekend.

He talked of how he had cleaned out his locker so his Mom wouldn't have to do it later and was carrying his stuff home.

He looked hard at me and gave me a little smile.

"Thankfully, I was saved.

My friend saved me from doing the unspeakable."

I heard the gasp go through the crowd as this handsome, popular boy told us all about his weakest moment.

I saw his Mom and dad looking at me and smiling that same grateful smile.

Not until that moment did I realize it's depth.

Never underestimate the power of your actions.

With one small gesture you can change a person's life.

For better or for worse.

"Friends are angels who lift us to our feet when our wings have trouble remembering how to fly."

There is no beginning or end.. Yesterday is history.

Tomorrow is mystery.

Today is a gift.
The RZA
So emotional & so very very true. My bro picks on people all the time & just refuses to believe some people will go over the edge & commit suicide or shoot up the school. My bro needs to get a reality check, I mean he just turned 15 on Saturday & I'm only 13 yet I know how serious bullying is to some.
~FMAgurl~
^^ My friend emailed that to me too. It made me cry.

zombie
QUOTE(~FMAgurl~ @ Nov 24 2005, 04:28 AM) [snapback]318724[/snapback]

^^ My friend emailed that to me too. It made me cry.

That almost made me cry and it takes a lot 2 make me cry.
Zarpia
Darn you Mrs. Edward Elric! you made me cry.
Toby-Chan
Sorry, EKE. :'(
japaneseobesession
one of my friends went under too much stress and juimped out of the 2nd floor window and ended up in a tree v_V she wasn't really hurt (a few scratches here and there) but yeah. She tried it, which makes me disappointed

if you don't want your life that much, think about all the people who died unwillingly and cherished their lives. When you're dead, and something HUGE happens, if you're a ghost (if there's such thing as an afterlife) and watch everyone be happy as if they forgot you, you'd be pretty disapointed, right?

...of course, I've tried plenty of times, but................................

................I used the feeblest attempt, so yeah.

..I've always wondered what it's like after you die though.. do you become ghost? ........ I have a few friends who died and came back to life, but they don't remember what it was like ;_;
Mrs. Edward Elric
ph34r.gif Sorry if I made you guys cry or whatever. It was just a little story one of my friends sent to me. But I really did hope you guys took it into consideration.
Carnal Malefactor
Serious suicide is for quitters and cowards.
'Attempted' suicide is for attention-starved brats.

That's all i have to say on this issue.
Chiyo
Slightly blunt Bacon but I see where your coming from
zombie
I can see where he is coming from 2 but I donít agree with him.
The RZA
QUOTE(What, no bacon? @ Nov 23 2005, 01:43 PM) [snapback]318749[/snapback]

Serious suicide is for quitters and cowards.
'Attempted' suicide is for attention-starved brats.

That's all i have to say on this issue.


Yeah you're right. I usually never feel bad for people that try suicide. If I may quote a Tupac song;"If you can make it through the night there's a brighter day". So even if you're depressed and think it's all over there's going to be a better day. You just got to keep ya head up.
Carnal Malefactor
No kidding. I'd gotten so depressed over the last few months because my job search seemed to be going nowhere. I'd joke about heading to the bathtub with a razor, but I'd never actually consider doing something like that.
Suicide is letting life get the best of you. If you feel like you're drowning, you don't just let the tide drag you under, do you? Hell no! You struggle and try to swim to safety.
Mrs. Edward Elric
The people who have committed/attempted suicide, I can understand. To them, life is just too hard, and they just want to get it over with. But in reality, suicide is really a permanent solution to a temporary problem.
The RZA
Yea life shouldn't get the best of you. You look it in the eye, beat the hell out of it, and let it know it can't beat you.
zombie
Drowning is one of the worst ways 2 go. thats all I say about that
When someone comities suicide they are not thinking straight. So they may not even know what they are doing.
DZBrick6
QUOTE(Mrs. Edward Elric @ Nov 23 2005, 01:06 PM) [snapback]318762[/snapback]

suicide is really a permanent solution to a temporary problem.



Bingo, my thoughts exactly when asked about the subject. And, yeah, with all the crap I've gotten through over the last three years, I at one time considered the idea, did a pretty good job, actually, somebody just happen to find me too soon or just in time, depending on your own opinion. After that bullshit, I decided not to let things get to me that badly again. It was a stupid thing to do, but it made me even more determined in the end. Nobody gets the best of me anymore...I'm too friggin' bullheaded now!
zombie
what about it when someone is sick and they are not going to get better?
Carnal Malefactor
QUOTE(zombie @ Nov 23 2005, 10:07 PM) [snapback]318951[/snapback]

what about it when someone is sick and they are not going to get better?

That's a completely different situation.
zombie
No its not. its still suicide.
Carnal Malefactor
QUOTE(zombie @ Nov 23 2005, 10:12 PM) [snapback]318961[/snapback]

No its not. its still suicide.

What are you, retarded? There's a world of difference between some terminally ill geriatric who just wants the pain to end and knows there's no hope for a cure, and some pathetic 16-year-old depressed goth kid who decides it's time to bow out because he's ostracized at school.
zombie
What if this goth kid was out of their mind when they kill themself
Most of the time when people do kill themself they are not thinking right and have no idea what they are doing.

And yes there is a dofference but its still suicide.
Carnal Malefactor
QUOTE(zombie @ Nov 23 2005, 10:16 PM) [snapback]318967[/snapback]

What if this goth kid was out of their mind when they kill themself
Most of the time when people do kill themself they are not thinking right and have no idea what they are doing.

'not thinking right' is a temporary state of mnd. A terminal disease is permanent.
Celestial Shadow
But Bacon, you DO realize that there are certain emotional situations that would make a "normal" person feel like comitting suicide, don't you?
Carnal Malefactor
QUOTE(Celestial Fangirl @ Nov 23 2005, 10:23 PM) [snapback]318975[/snapback]

But Bacon, you DO realize that there are certain emotional situations that would make a "normal" person feel like comitting suicide, don't you?

Again... permanent solution to a temporary problem.
Celestial Shadow
True, but the problem could be reoccuring.
Carnal Malefactor
QUOTE(Celestial Fangirl @ Nov 23 2005, 10:28 PM) [snapback]318981[/snapback]

True, but the problem could be reoccuring.

Go see a shrink about it. Get counseling. I have zero sympathy for people who commit suicide because of depression.
Molecular Alchemist
I really can't understand why anyone would want to kill themselves...well, aside from what I deem "special cases" ...like... a benevolant cause (the greater good)..etc. I mean, there are exceptions, but for the most part, I think that suicide is stupid, for lack of a better word. We all go through crap in our lives...plain and simple. If we didn't, we wouldn't be living. The beauty of it all is learning how to overcome our hardships and become a stronger person...giving in to fear and sadness...no.....suicide should never be an option.

*Note.."greater good" means that by sacrificing youself, you would save the lives of others....umm..doesn't happen often..but, in my opinion...I think it would be worth it smile.gif
bryantq
Tsk tsk, we must teach people to channel those emotional situations into hatred tongue.gif. lol

Instead of killing yourself, kill others! or something tongue.gif

I jest, but of all things in this world from plants to animals to humans, friends, foes, neighbors, enemies -- we all strive for one thing unconditionally: to survive.

Suicide comes to humans with the idea that it is a way out from a potentially unseen future. To take a radical spin on it: a soldier captured in war, who KNOWS his enemy will torture him and eventually kill him, would rather die at his own hands than suffer further.

However, it is the inability for some to appropriately gauge the situation that they are in. For this soldier may be rescued, unbeknownst to him. Whether or not the soldier can determine if rescue is possible is the key factor.

A person feels that life is no longer worth living, because nothing could ever be any better, and will only go worse, however as most people will point out, life is what you make of it. However that person, may determine that there is no plausible way that things could get better.

I beg to differ. Life is a gift, living your life is a challenge, an honor, and a means to discover oneself.

You live your life to honor yourself, your family, your work, your ideals and beliefs. You live your life in a manner to challenge yourself, through peril, tribulation, joys, defeats, and victory. You live to defend your ideals, you live to embrace your beliefs and stand up for them. You have plenty of reasons to live... but once again, life is what you make of it.

I believe it is a human's responsibility to themselves and to nature to strive, to perservere, and to live. Live to see the next day, live to accomplish your goals, live to do what you want.

That soldier can fight. In the very least he can die trying to live.

Terminally ill? Work to do the things you want to do. fight or die trying.

Life is hard? Life is sad? Work to turn it around into your favor, or die trying.

But don't give up, for that makes existance meaningless. Because that means you've wasted everyone's time. If you concede, you are wasting the valuable, precious time that your family, your parents, your friends, your teachers have invested into YOU.

My two cents. Now if only others could see it the same way.
Celestial Shadow
QUOTE(bryantq @ Nov 23 2005, 09:38 PM) [snapback]318988[/snapback]

My two cents. Now if only others could see it the same way.
More like 5 cents, sir @.@ But well said.

I believe everything you said was true but...When you're truly, REALLY depressed, you sometimes can't think straight. No matter what you may have believed at one time, when you fall into total despair, you're likely to do things you wouldn't.

Sometimes a way out can seem so seductive...Even if you are deluding yourself into thinking anything can be better than your current life. It only takes one shot, one split-second decision to end your life. Whether or not you regret it then, it's too late.

People tend to look upon souls like these in this kind of situation (which I suspect what happens to most suicide "victims") and say they were weak, pathetic, and didn't deserve life anyway. Yeah, they are weak, but why can't people understand exactly why they sometimes do it?
Envy's lil' miniskirt
I don't really know if I consider someone who is suicidal selfish. As someone who used to suffer from horrible bouts of depression I remember what a hopeless loser I felt like and if I left this world it wouldn't make one bit of difference. I used to spend days curled up on the couch in a fetal position or in bed wishing it would all end. I went though depression for years and nobody want to deal with someobody that depressed because "you're bumming me out man" so of course you do feel alone like nobody cares. When you're that depressed they don't.

As a teen I had a horrible family life and got laughed at when I told my family I was going to kill myself. I tried to slit my wrists, couldn't, my self preservation wouldn't let me and I was too much of a wus to do it. I went though my grandparent meds trying to figure out if anything was leathal but decided against it because I didn't want to end up in the hospital with some perminate damage to my body. I was a prefectionist if it wasn't going to kill me I didn't want to bother. I couldn't hang myself because I lived in a moble home and the celling wouldn't hold. There was no trains to jump in front of and no building tall enought to jump off that would kill me. So I stuck it out best I could and told myself I would be an adult soon and be able to get away from all of it.

But I carried it into adulthood it wasn't just a teenage phase. By then I was good at talking myself out of suicide so I never tried as an adult. Although I did have a plan if I decided to really go through with it I was going to fly to somewhere like Hawaii and walk into the ocean. However, as I got older I started to realize that if I had killed myself back then there's lots of things I never would of gotten to do and people I never would of gotten to meet. Often I would be doing those things and say to myself "If I had killed myself I wouldn't be here doing this right now" I began to realize that there would be people that did love me and would be greatly affected if I did go thought with it. If I had snuffed it I never would of gotten to run off and join the circus, I never would of gotten to perform in all the shows I did, I never would of been able to make costume and dress up like a big dork at conventions and meet at the cool people I've meet doing these things.

So yes it's selfish to take your own life because there are people who will be greatly affected by it but nobody can understand the hopelessness and self loathing that somebody who suffers from that level of depression goes though unless they themselves go through it and telling someone to get over it doesn't work because if they could get over it they would believe me.

I've noticed I don't go through depression like I used to now that I've started studying buddhism and putting the praticies into my life. I still get the blues now and then but I deal with the suffering of life much better than I used to.
bryantq
QUOTE(Celestial Fangirl @ Nov 23 2005, 08:45 PM) [snapback]318993[/snapback]

Yeah, they are weak, but why can't people understand exactly why they sometimes do it?


I don't intend to say i know it all or know all the reasons but heres what i think:

Why they do it is because they feel they've been beaten.

If life keeps giving you blows, you hurt, you pain, you wince. I say, Grin and bear, pick yourself up, fight back, work hard. Sounds hard. Harder than anyone could possibly imagine, and harder than anyone could compare to.

When the true thought of suicide arrives, the amount of psychological turmoil is severe. It takes a strong will to survive. It takes an even stronger person to do what i said.

I feel the biggest problem that people who consider suicide have is that they feel they are alone. You might not be able to fight back by yourself, but there are people who care, and are willing to help you. It is through friendship and support that people can save themselves. They also think that their lives dont impact anyone, but undoubtedly they do.

No one is alone in this world, and thats something that everyone needs to remember.
Celestial Shadow
@Mini- I empathize with you more than I would like. Besides being too much of a coward, I just felt that it wasn't fair to others to do that...That and I never want to be the girl everyone gossips about in school about how she killed herself. I just can't stand the thought of people judging me and saying whatever they want without me being able to be there and defend myself.

You're kind of an inspiration for me I guess.


@bryantq- I admire your personality, I really do. I even envy it. Keep thinking that way, but don't forget that there are others who aren't as strong as you sir smile.gif
Bling_bling_Angel
*shrugs*

For me--please note the term "FOR ME", meaning I'm not making it a dogma--I find suicide very stupid, with the exception cited by Bacon. [I agree with him].

Suicide is very stupid and unfortunately shows how very narrow-minded you are. [another word for stupid, I guess... tongue.gif] I mean, it's a cliche, but I strongly believe in the saying "There's hope while you breathe". Okay, so life can be a reallll damn bitch at times, but are you gonna give up just cuz of THAT? I mean, heck, other people have gone through rougher things and yet survived, and over some heartbreak or whatnot, you're gonna end it all? It's stupid, plain and simple. I mean, hello? There'e a tomorrow - and you CAN do something about it, depsite what that seedy little voice at the back of your head is telling you.
Celestial Shadow
You're just one of those fortunate people, Blingy.
Bling_bling_Angel
Awha~? How...?

Okay, so maybe not everyone's born the "same"--in any snese of it--but we all have the free will to push on, depsite the crapstorms, right? XD
Envy's lil' miniskirt
QUOTE(Celestial Fangirl @ Nov 23 2005, 08:06 PM) [snapback]319010[/snapback]

@Mini- I empathize with you more than I would like. Besides being too much of a coward, I just felt that it wasn't fair to others to do that...That and I never want to be the girl everyone gossips about in school about how she killed herself. I just can't stand the thought of people judging me and saying whatever they want without me being able to be there and defend myself.

You're kind of an inspiration for me I guess.



Aww thanks Celes. tongue.gif

See, if I had go though with it I wouldn't be the perverted oddball I am today. tongue.gif
Celestial Shadow
QUOTE(Bling_bling_Angel @ Nov 23 2005, 10:20 PM) [snapback]319020[/snapback]

Awha~? How...?

Okay, so maybe not everyone's born the "same"--in any snese of it--but we all have the free will to push on, depsite the crapstorms, right? XD
Free will, yes, but not everyone is able or willing to use it before they fall into despair.


QUOTE(Envy @ Nov 23 2005, 10:29 PM) [snapback]319030[/snapback]
Aww thanks Celes. tongue.gif

See, if I had go though with it I wouldn't be the perverted oddball I am today. tongue.gif
laugh.gif That's a good thing? tongue.gif
Bling_bling_Angel
*hugs Celes*

Oh, come on... ^^...

Why will you despair? *laughs some* Before you fall into that hole, think first... think, and then actually see that there is a thing we call "hope". And trust us, it works.
Celestial Shadow
Aw thanks, but I know. I and people in general just have to remember it smile.gif
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