HAGANE NO RENKINJUTSUSHI
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His Dark Materials ~ Philil Pulman, Good, Bad or Awful?
His Dark Materials ~ Philil Pulman
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Le Monkey
post Apr 13 2006, 06:04 PM
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I have always loved these books and they are in my favorite selection of books, But what do you think?


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Popogeejo
post Apr 13 2006, 06:11 PM
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First book was Great.Really enjoyed the philophsy and plot.then Phil made a mistake.ROMANTIC SUB-PLOT!
Half way through the second book it just got crap.
The ending was a cleiche aswell.
"Make your own Paradise" my arse.It was just lazy writting.

Philip took something with great potential and trid to ride the wave of populararity without trying to improve or even maintain a coherent plot.
(See also:Matrix)

I recomend the first one but just make up you own seaquels as yu couldn't fugg it up any worse than he did.


IMO.


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Le Monkey
post Apr 13 2006, 08:47 PM
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QUOTE(popogeejo @ Apr 13 2006, 05:56 PM) [snapback]380275[/snapback]
Philip took something with great potential and trid to ride the wave of populararity without trying to improve or even maintain a coherent plot.
(See also:Matrix)

I recomend the first one but just make up you own seaquels as yu couldn't fugg it up any worse than he did.


You say there wasnt an improving or coherent plot?
I disagree there, the story was always unfolding, slowly evolving and I always found them so captivating.
The romance sub plot is normally someehting done so badly, but on this occasion I really liked it adnd found it not a strain to read like most others I have read.
I loves the indepth discriptions that made you feel like you were there and you could almost feel it.
These kept me captivated for the whole 3 weeks it took me to read, find, read, find, find the damn book, read the whole 3 books.

These books are a good read for most people and if you are going to read a book, read a pullman book as his other set of books were well set and captivating aswell.

I will say that I always get so very into books that I live through them rather than read them if you know what I mean wich is patialy why detailed descriptions mean so much to me.


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MonsterEnvy
post Apr 13 2006, 09:06 PM
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I strongly disagree with popo too. You obviously didn't read into the books enough. They were a powerful metaphor that had to do with original sin, the Catholic church, moral values, and what is 'right.' You also miss the point of the'sub plot,' as you incorrectly call it. The entire point of the series is to 'tempt' Lyra and Will into original sin- love. They also described teh corruption of the Pope (Megatron, or whatever, in the book) in usurping power from the Authority, and the Authority in the first place for claiming to be the creator simply because he was first. It's like creationism claiming that it's right just because it's before evolution.

They were fascinatingly deep, symbologically complex books on a level that is only equaled by Dante's *amazing* Commedia. If anyone hasn't read the Divine Comedy, you must. Not only does it mention the Seven Deadly Sins in detail, it's an amazing work from the hands down best poet in history (Shakespeare looks like a baby scribbling with a marker comparatively) I especially liked the recent translation by John Ciardi.

But, I digress. The Divine Comedy and His Dark Materials are simply two outstanding books in a series of those dealing with Faith, and God, and morality, and all of those other issues that are so fascinating to read and talk about.

Dantephile forever! yay.


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Popogeejo
post Apr 13 2006, 09:26 PM
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To be fair I only read he series once and that was awhile ago.
I still think it was flawed and crap but I'll read it again with an (half) open mind.
I'd rather read Dante though.


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MonsterEnvy
post Apr 13 2006, 09:32 PM
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Dante was good, but you should be careful. I'm still in Paradiso, and it's been 3 months. It's wonderful, but not for the average teenager... I can normally read books in a day (no matter the length) but these take a LOT longer.

Anyway, you should read His Dark Materials again with a more open mind.


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Lone Wolf
post Apr 13 2006, 09:33 PM
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These books were pretty good, not the best I've read, but they were still good. I think the first one was the best. The second was alright, but I didn't find the last book as satisfying as the other two... It got a little confusing. Still, they were good reads.


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Le Monkey
post Apr 13 2006, 09:36 PM
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@Pop: Why wont you go into something with an open mind, fully happy to accept that something isnt how you first percieve it?


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Ailuro
post Apr 13 2006, 09:40 PM
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Oh, yes, I really like this series. I read them in my first year of highschool, and I was hooked. I especially liked the creatures from the third book, the ones that seemed sort of like elephants.
Also, I loved the plot and the diction. smile.gif


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Popogeejo
post Apr 13 2006, 09:41 PM
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But if I open I mind I might chage it ohmy.gif [/joke]
Just for you Monkey Boy I'll ty and find the book and re-read it.

@Monster:I have no Problems with long books.In stints of half an hour a day I read the full Lord of the Rings trillogy.I'm sure Dante Is tougher but I'm a stuborn asshole and WILL read it. wink.gif


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MonsterEnvy
post Apr 13 2006, 09:46 PM
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No, you misunderstand. It's not long, it's inordinately complex and symbologically fascinating. All three canticles put together in the version I have could hardly be 400 pages, mainly of short lines. I also kept having to look up articles on different Popes and Florentine history, political conflict, Dante and Beatrice, the history of the Catholic church, exactly who Cassius was, when the practice of Simonism started and its progression among hundreds of others to simply understand the book, let alone really comprehend it. It was amazingly fascinating, though.


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Le Monkey
post Apr 13 2006, 09:48 PM
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If you really wanted popo and couldnt find them, I can send you a copy of the book.. just so you can read it with an open mind.. you might supprise yourself with the books


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Popogeejo
post Apr 13 2006, 09:52 PM
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QUOTE
No, you misunderstand. It's not long, it's inordinately complex and symbologically fascinating. All three canticles put together in the version I have could hardly be 400 pages, mainly of short lines. I also kept having to look up articles on different Popes and Florentine history, political conflict, Dante and Beatrice, the history of the Catholic church, exactly who Cassius was, when the practice of Simonism started and its progression among hundreds of others to simply understand the book, let alone really comprehend it. It was amazingly fascinating, though.


Bring it on.I'll try my best with it.

QUOTE
If you really wanted popo and couldnt find them, I can send you a copy of the book.. just so you can read it with an open mind.. you might supprise yourself with the books


Not needed Monkey Boy.I have them somewhere in my abode.If I can't find it then I have plenty of friends who do.


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Le Monkey
post Apr 13 2006, 10:03 PM
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Ok then, and Dantes divine comedy is again in my list of books to be read, but things always end up getting in the way.. dry.gif


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Chiyo
post Apr 20 2006, 09:55 AM
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I think many of the underlying theme are far to deep for the children the book is aimed at to comprehend. To be honest, it was too much for me to take in but I did not care enought to want to look further into it. I enjoyed reading them yes, but that was about it.


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