HAGANE NO RENKINJUTSUSHI
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Are You Religious?
Are you religious?
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Colette
post Aug 30 2008, 06:54 PM
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Bumping it up because after 15 years of living in Nebraska, a Christian conservative state, I'm really just starting to lose my mind and losing my tolerance to organized religion. I'm just quoting bits and pieces from other forums because I'm pretty much too lazy to organize it into one essay.

QUOTE
I honestly and truly cannot understand why anyone would want to be a Christian and were not simply raised one. I was raised by a rapidly losing her faith Catholic mother and a life long Lutheran father; in other words, I wasn't raised in a really religious household lolz. But I went to church for most of my childhood, I attended Sunday school, all up until my parents got new jobs and we simply had no time to go to church anymore. It was at this point that, more so than ever, I began to question my faith. Why? Because I was actually looking at it from afar, from an objective point of view. I couldn't attend church, so I actually read the Bible. I read through it once believing it was all the words of God, and was confused at the content and how the loving God I was raised to know could say and do such, well, non Christian things. Then I read it again, this time not as a Christian practicing good faith by reading the Bible, but as someone assuming this was just a book, not the words of God. The arguments I made up to defend God the first time I read the Bible disappeared. I couldn't defend my faith, and I couldn't bring myself to want to. I started questioning more and more things. Why, for example, was it bad that I couldn't attend church anymore? What was so different about praying at home? Did God just listen harder for people in churches? That wouldn't make sense; the people who really need their prayers answered probably aren't in a church at the moment; more likely a foxhole or a hospital. Why didn't God answer any of my prayers? When I was little I asked for ridiculous (yet awesome) things like psychic powers and ..... (In addition to raised as a Christian I was raised with comic books) I knew why God didn't answer those; they were prayers solely for self satisfaction and utterly unreasonable. But what about everyone else? I didn't want my house to flood, I didn't want to have to move, I didn't want my parents to always be fighting and grow to hate each other. That line of thinking brought me to a rather famous quote;

"Is God willing to prevent evil, but not able?
Then he is not omnipotent.
Is he able, but not willing?
Then he is malevolent.
Is he both able and willing?
Then whence cometh evil?
Is he neither willing or evil?
Then why do we call him God?"

Still, even after all that, I was a Christian for two more years. Why? Because I was scared. I was scared my family would hate me for not believing in God, because it was only AFTER I told my immediate family that I found out my mom and brother weren't religious either. (And even that was largely my influence. My older brother was a Christian still after I told him I didn't believe in God. I admit I kinda tried to persuade him otherwise; my brother is a very intelligent person, he had always had his doubts about his fate, but I pointed out my biggest concerns about them and eventually he did his own thinking and is an atheist now. My mom is a deist; when she was kicked out of her Catholic church for being an unwed mother, she converted to being a Lutheran, but when taking a brief questionare she answered "Yes" to a question about children being born without sin. The answer was no, because of the original sin. My mom, being a labor and delivery nurse, refused to accept the idea that a newborn baby had any sins or evil at all.) I was also scared because, guess what, Christianity has this little bit to it about how you burn in Hell for all eternity if you deny God. Even if you were a good person. By a Christian's belief, Ghandi is burning in hell right now.

So, after being loosely raised a Christian, as I was exposed to other sides of the God argument and looked at my faith for what it is, I rejected God and all religions going along with him. My immediate family and my friends (and the internets I suppose) are the only ones who know this; most of my family would disown me in a heartbeat if they knew I was an atheist. I'm not scared of their reactions anymore, I'd just rather avoid unnecessary drama. Plus, I want some inheritance goddammit.


QUOTE
I'd argue that fear has everything to do with religion; to the very reason of its existence. We fear the unknown, nobody wants to die, and everyone wants to believe that after death there's something nice waiting for us. People fear they won't reach that and follow their Holy Book of choosing sometimes word for word. Stone your non virgin wife. Kill the infidels. If your children talk back, beat/kill them depending on the magnitude of it. People are driven by fear, and also driven by religion. I'd say the two overlap a very large percentage of the time. Certainly, politics comes into play, but as I said earlier it's a very useful tool for the public, sometimes used as the justification, or the means to get to the end result.

I don't believe that God created man. I believe man created God out of their fear and ignorance. Not of their stupidity, as Aelph pointed out, they are entirely two different things. But as science makes more discoveries, faith is merely working around them rather than accepting them. (Hence our lovely little "Intelligent Design" theories) At this point I don't think a higher being is even necessary, as Ryke stated, and the farther we advance the more I think we'll be seeing this. We seem to be getting stuck right after we make a discovery, and using God as the answer is something I see as just giving up.


QUOTE
I don't hate Christians, and I don't think they're all unintelligent people. But I do dislike the nature of Christianity. I try to respect other people's opinions, but when someone's belief is that I deserve to suffer for all eternity, I find it hard to maintain a live and let live policy. What I believe is that Christianity is unnecessary and it has had negative effects on humankind. It's had good effects too. I'm glad people can have more faith in living because of it, and work hard to be good people, but when the cost is countless wars over who's God is the right God, shafting aside homosexual's rights just because "it offends our religion", and hundreds of other horrible things, well...I just think the toll price is too high and it simply isn't worth it. You don't need religion to have morals, or to have a desire to live.


QUOTE
Yes, I am. I'm quoting the exact beliefs the bible outlines in plain view. If they claim to be Christians, they claim to believe these things. It's exactly as jimbob 11 stated; Christianity is not a buffet. You either take the whole damn package or none of it. Do you believe in God but not his teachings? Then be a deist. I'm not saying Christians think Hitler is a great guy and that Gandhi was a bad man. I didn't even mention Hitler. I'm saying that by the teachings of Jesus Christ, Gandhi is in hell for rejecting him as his savior.



tl;dr no, I'm not religious.


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daggertrepe
post Aug 31 2008, 11:01 AM
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I am a Christian. I was raised one and I believe hole-heartedly in God, even though it is extremely hard to follow his word. as a Christian, I will admit that. But we are human and we make mistakes, and those who believe in the lord ask for his forgiveness.

But here is what peeves me about most Christians, or 'so called' ones. They push their religion on other people. They say 'oh if you don't believe in the Lord Jesus Christ you're going to hell.' That's not what Christianity is about. It's about loving and helping others despite what their beliefs are. God never said to attack those who don't believe in him. But people do it anyway because they think they are high and mighty, clean and sober. Well even those people have issues. That's why being a real Christian means getting down and dirty to help others without gain. That's what it really means and it's so vastly overlooked that it really is sad.

For this, I cannot blame Atheists for hating us. What I do hate is how they attack us because of what some other 'Christians' said to them. That's not right either. I really think we should just accept each other and help each other out. There are good things about both parties.


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FailToImpress
post Aug 31 2008, 11:42 AM
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I'm not religious at all, being an Atheist.
My mum was brought up as a Catholic and she attended church as a child etc etc, but when she got a bit older she changed her views and no longer believed in god (I think she had good reason to change her mind but I'll not get into it). I have a brother, and we both were brought up by our parents to choose a religion if we wanted to, nothing was forced upon us and I'm SO thankful for that. smile.gif

When I become a parent, I'll do my best to do the same thing.
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Colette
post Aug 31 2008, 01:35 PM
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QUOTE
But here is what peeves me about most Christians, or 'so called' ones. They push their religion on other people. They say 'oh if you don't believe in the Lord Jesus Christ you're going to hell.' That's not what Christianity is about.
....But that was the biggest part OF Christianity; if you do not accept Jesus Christ as your savior, you go to hell. You can't say that isn't what Christianity is about when it's the very basis of the teachings. As I said earlier, Christianity is not a buffet. Picking and choices the teachings and scriptures to your liking is not only pointless, but it's specifically stated that all the rules of the Old Testament apply, making it, in fact, sinful. Sure, not all the teachings are practiced anymore (probably because you'd get arrested if you lived by the Bible word for word) But the point is that once you start picking which apply and which don't, when you do stop? Okay, we're going to stop the whole 'stoning women if they aren't virgins on their wedding day' thing, should we also allow gays to marry?

QUOTE
God never said to attack those who don't believe in him.
The God of the Christian religion, particularly in the Old Testament, was not the loving and benevolent God he is portrayed as. The amount of people that think this is really quite alarming and harmful to the religion as a whole. Ever heard of the village of Sodom? I wouldn't give them the "Village of the Year" award, but I'd say that follows under "attacking those without fate".

QUOTE
What I do hate is how they attack us because of what some other 'Christians' said to them. That's not right either.
They're a part of their religion just as much as you are, and they're entitled to their opinions. Incidentally, their opinions are shared with a vast majority of other Christians. When this happens, they begin to appear tospeak for everyone in the religion instead of just themselves. Don't like it? Let them know that, don't blame atheists for it. I can't stand how most people view atheism, but I understand why they do because atheists are few and far between in the United States, and the vocal ones have the appearance of speaking for everyone. (For example, I was rather offended when a billion pages back, Bacon stated that atheists didn't worry about offending people. This doesn't apply to me personally, but it's a stereotype that can be backed up, so I see where he's coming from and don't disagree) The vocal ones are usually annoying. I enjoyed Sam Harris's "Letters to a Christian Nation", but Dawkins "The God Delusion" was irritating to read. Why? Because he's just as blind as the average Christian, who believes that God MUST exist; Dawkins believes the God must NOT, which is still in every way merely a belief. I call myself an atheist, but I'm open to the idea of God. I don't believe there is one, but I'm not denying the possibility, and I live my life under the assumption that he's not looking out for me, which sets my belief system apart from deism.

Honestly, I think society gives religion this "untouchable" status. It shouldn't. Religion is not a race, nor is it something you're simply born with. (You can be raised with it, but if you keep your religion solely because that's the religion you were raised with, you deserve anything someone throws at you for not thinking for yourself) It's an entirely debatable topic just like any other.


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The Mad Bomber
post Aug 31 2008, 01:37 PM
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^ You make some valid points there.

QUOTE(daggertrepe @ Aug 31 2008, 09:01 PM) *
But here is what peeves me about most Christians, or 'so called' ones. They push their religion on other people. They say 'oh if you don't believe in the Lord Jesus Christ you're going to hell.'


You mean fanatics? No sorry I shouldn`t use, that term even about people like, that albeit I confess it stresses me, an agnostic, when a Jehovah witness bumps onto my front door. No thank you. In my country most of the people are members of the Evangelic Lutheran, a protest obviously, Church all tough we have some Orthodox here as well due to our relatively close proximity to Russia, being in eastern Europe and having been under Russia`s rule for about 100 years.

Anyhow, I have kinda conflicted feelings about the almighty, I believe in decent human qualities and manners, that the bible actually promotes. And I might wonder whether there is more to it than just that, but then again I find science giving me an answer that doesn`t seem far fetched either. Well IŽll probably tussle with the question for the rest of my life, but oh well.

All tough I must add, as one that takes interest in politics and history, religion has a bad way of ending up as a tool of political movements and for the greed of some people I`d guess. The Crusades and what we have now in the world, religion is a convenient excuse to some of the horrific acts mankind has decided to cast on one another. Yet one should not then cast down those religions as a whole because when followed correctly, and preferably peacefully, religion probably has a positive and strengthening effect on people`s lives....

Honestly I wouldn`t know, I am just guessing here. biggrin.gif


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daggertrepe
post Aug 31 2008, 02:38 PM
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QUOTE (Colette @ Aug 31 2008, 01:35 PM) *
QUOTE
But here is what peeves me about most Christians, or 'so called' ones. They push their religion on other people. They say 'oh if you don't believe in the Lord Jesus Christ you're going to hell.' That's not what Christianity is about.
....But that was the biggest part OF Christianity; if you do not accept Jesus Christ as your savior, you go to hell. You can't say that isn't what Christianity is about when it's the very basis of the teachings. As I said earlier, Christianity is not a buffet. Picking and choices the teachings and scriptures to your liking is not only pointless, but it's specifically stated that all the rules of the Old Testament apply, making it, in fact, sinful. Sure, not all the teachings are practiced anymore (probably because you'd get arrested if you lived by the Bible word for word) But the point is that once you start picking which apply and which don't, when you do stop? Okay, we're going to stop the whole 'stoning women if they aren't virgins on their wedding day' thing, should we also allow gays to marry?

QUOTE
God never said to attack those who don't believe in him.
The God of the Christian religion, particularly in the Old Testament, was not the loving and benevolent God he is portrayed as. The amount of people that think this is really quite alarming and harmful to the religion as a whole. Ever heard of the village of Sodom? I wouldn't give them the "Village of the Year" award, but I'd say that follows under "attacking those without fate".

QUOTE
What I do hate is how they attack us because of what some other 'Christians' said to them. That's not right either.
They're a part of their religion just as much as you are, and they're entitled to their opinions. Incidentally, their opinions are shared with a vast majority of other Christians. When this happens, they begin to appear tospeak for everyone in the religion instead of just themselves. Don't like it? Let them know that, don't blame atheists for it. I can't stand how most people view atheism, but I understand why they do because atheists are few and far between in the United States, and the vocal ones have the appearance of speaking for everyone. (For example, I was rather offended when a billion pages back, Bacon stated that atheists didn't worry about offending people. This doesn't apply to me personally, but it's a stereotype that can be backed up, so I see where he's coming from and don't disagree) The vocal ones are usually annoying. I enjoyed Sam Harris's "Letters to a Christian Nation", but Dawkins "The God Delusion" was irritating to read. Why? Because he's just as blind as the average Christian, who believes that God MUST exist; Dawkins believes the God must NOT, which is still in every way merely a belief. I call myself an atheist, but I'm open to the idea of God. I don't believe there is one, but I'm not denying the possibility, and I live my life under the assumption that he's not looking out for me, which sets my belief system apart from deism.

Honestly, I think society gives religion this "untouchable" status. It shouldn't. Religion is not a race, nor is it something you're simply born with. (You can be raised with it, but if you keep your religion solely because that's the religion you were raised with, you deserve anything someone throws at you for not thinking for yourself) It's an entirely debatable topic just like any other.

Yeah, but just because someone doesn't believe in God, doesn't give us a reason not to help them or love them. I will never bash someone for their beliefs, even if others do. I will continue to believe that Christianity is not about putting it on others and putting them down. I don't see how that's picking and choosing because the bible never states to bash any non-Christians. What everyone else believes in has nothing to do with what I believe in.

Sodom and Gomorrah were extremely sinful cities, and were destroyed because of the extreme sin going on. Just because God destroyed Sodom and Gomorrah doesn't give us the right to destroy the non-religious.

I don't agree with most Christians, but what are we going to do? Throw tomatoes at them and scream? I can't tell them anything. I just think we should all stop attacking one another. I'm not blaming the atheists any more than I am blaming the Christians. The violence between all of us won't ever stop though.


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Forgiven
post Apr 9 2009, 05:14 PM
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Not at all. Christianity isn't a religion, its a relationship.
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Hagaren_4ever
post Jun 23 2009, 01:18 PM
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I'm going to go ahead and say the same thing I said for the "heaven? hell?" thread.

QUOTE (Hagaren_4ever @ Jun 23 2009, 12:47 PM) *
Right now, I'd say I'm pretty much agnostic. I'm going to admit to myself that I'm never really going to know all the secrets of the universe. So, I'm just going to live my life as well as I can, being good to others, and trying to bring joy to people in my life. And if I do something to upset the "God" that may be out there, than I'm willing to except the punishment he gives me. That is, unless I someday convert... 0_o



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Forsaken Love
post Jun 23 2009, 01:23 PM
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im religious but i have my own personal beliefs as it were, which i belive in completly and fully, there is not one religion i completly agree with, i agree with parts from practically all of the ones i know of with a bit of my own stuff in the mix, so i can't really say i belong to one, although i've been brought up with Islam


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Mhacy
post Jun 24 2009, 02:14 AM
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im not religious but not at all..
maybe a little..
I still believe in GOD and everything that is written in the bible..
im just confused of some things...that made me doubt HIM.


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Hagaren_4ever
post Jun 25 2009, 08:12 AM
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QUOTE (Mhacy @ Jun 24 2009, 05:14 AM) *
im not religious but not at all..
maybe a little..
I still believe in GOD and everything that is written in the bible..
im just confused of some things...that made me doubt HIM.


That's how it starts.


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angelstar2408
post Jun 26 2009, 02:53 AM
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QUOTE (Jellybean @ Oct 20 2005, 11:40 AM) *
laugh.gif That was great!

I was raised catholic, but never really got into it. I guess I'd consider myself an athiest now that no one's forcing me to go to church. happy.gif



QUOTE (Bob Allen @ Oct 21 2005, 01:31 AM) *
well my self i never went to church and i don't believe in anything anyone say about god and all that other .... because every one alive hasn't died or meet jesus like the script says he was here i think that a bunch of crap, if you do tell me what happens after you die,(that is what they talk about the after life anyways right well prove them right and not by words becasue i would still think you stuped)



Thank goodness I'm not alone!

I mean I'm an Atheist and that doesn't make me any worse than believers....
And I would just like to make it clear that Atheists aren't satanists! biggrin.gif

I'm a Catholic and my family are really religious that it's scary but I think it's unfair...being baptized when I was an infant....

And now after all the stuff that happened to me and my family.... I'm proud to be an Atheist and I'm proud to say that I only believe what I see and 'God' isn't one of them...

Don't get me wrong though...I respect believers. smile.gif


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Edward Cardinal ...
post Jun 28 2009, 12:16 AM
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Am I religious? Take a look at my signature and take an educated guess wink.gif .


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Aribelle
post Jun 28 2009, 01:56 AM
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I was raised Catholic, and while I was at a Catholic high school and had to take religion classes and everything I was definitely spiritual (especially my senior year - I took a world religions class and had some deep thoughts laugh.gif), but that has since faded and right now I'm not religious/spiritual at all. I'm not really clear on what my beliefs are at this point, but I don't really have the time to sort through them. I have faith in people, and for now that's enough for me smile.gif


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kkg22104
post Jun 28 2009, 03:08 AM
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I have friends who are Christian, Jewish, Muslim, and atheist but I'm personally agnostic. My dad's family is Buddhist, which I learned when I came to visit them, and I even helped in their little ceremony. Anyway, my parents and I don't go to church, so I'm basically not religious at all.


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