Joined: 14-November 06
Member No.: 42,805
Did Edward ever learn that Envy killed Hughes?
Anime1 shows no evidence of him possessing this knowledge, but there is no proof he was oblivious either. There is one strong possibility that Edward did find out, and it could have happened during his alliance with Lust between Episodes 46 and 47. So why would it happen? One has to know Edward's state of mind at that point. His No. 1 priority was protecting Alphonse the Philosopher Stone at all costs. This, of course, meant his second priority was destroying the Homunculus who wanted Al (giving their mother- the Homunculus Sloth- a huge placein Edward's thoughts towards this dark goal). But after these two priorities is Edward's loss of Maes Hughes. Now, one has to remember Hughes' importance to Edward in the first series. In the manga/Brotherhood, the Brothers knew the man for only a few months. In Anime1, that relationship was stretched to four years, establishing a strong bond. To Edward, Hughes was probably the father he wanted to have. In their first meeting in Episode 5, we have Edward walking atop a train, making his first steps in his long and dangerous journey. When he falls, Hughes is there to catch him (rather strong fellow to carry a kid with metal limbs while on a ladder! Come to think of it, Nazi Hughes was able to stop an older, taller Edward in his tracks and throw him to Nazi cronies. All the Hughes were built). Later, the man holds a birthday party for Edward, leading to the birth of his daughter. Hughes refers to Edward as Elysia's 'brother.' Although the Brothers four-year journey meant few meetings, there must have been many correspondence between the two (there is an official drawing documenting Edward writing a letter to you-know-who). So, there was a strong father-and-son bond between Ed (& Al) and Hughes. So his grief over Hughes' death was definitely greater and the Anime1 faithfully portrays it in a 'turd-meet-fan' way. 'He was our...friend,' the angry Edward is awkward speaking about Hughes' importance, implying he was really going to call the man 'father' if not for his own daddy issues. But unlike Roy, Edward doesn't allow vengeance to color his goals. He tells Schieszka this, speaking about how revenge ruined Scar. Besides, such dark thoughts might hinder his protection of Al (even if his means of protection- killing his mother- is a dark deed in itself). If anything, Hughes' death had strengthened Edward's resolve to stop the Homunculus, so they can never harm another good person or innocent. Still, Hughes' death is definitely on Edward's mind when he makes his alliance with Lust to destroy the rest of her brethren. For all he knows, Lust may be the murderer! So, its possible that Edward is going to bring the subject up as they make their trap. It either came out as a reluctantly civil question 'Tell me Lust, did you kill Maes Hughes?' or a more aggressive declaration: 'I have trouble trusting someone like you. You killed millions of people. You killed my friend Hughes.' And Lust would have confessed the whole truth of her innocence and Envy's guilt. Unlike her manga counterpart, Anime1Lust had turned against her brethren (she carved that transmutation circle for Sloth), and would sell them out. She needed Edward's help to make her human, knowing that Dante would never do it. If she was going to win Edward's trust, Lust was going to have to tell him the truth about Hughes. It would have been an easy confession, since she did not do the deed herself. Also, in Episode 49, Edward reveals to Dante he knows about her body problem. Now, he knew about Dante's longevity and her relationship with her father, but how would he know about the body-decomposition? Through Lust. If that is so, she would have told him about Hughes as well. At any rate, Envy confirmed things. In Episode 50, he points to Gluttony as Marcoh's murderer- after taking Marcoh's form- but as Hughes (...), Envy makes no admittance about his own deed. And Edward is intelligent enough to note that omission was a confession in itself.
Joined: 14-November 06
Member No.: 42,805
QUOTE (Vlyse @ Apr 17 2010, 10:07 PM)
I'm sure this was answered before, but I couldn't find it so my question:
How was water fitting for Sloth? Brotherhood's version makes so much more sense..
Basically liquid is something of a lazy thing. It stays where it is unless something else does the moving for it (a hole in the containment area, pouring, etc.). If a person was made out of liquid without any containment, then it would just sink to the floor and just lie there. Sloth also means one's inability to take responsibility given to him or her. Trisha was the most devoted mother to Ed and Al. Sloth does nothing for the kids. She never visits or communicates with them. Worse, she tries to kill the boys because they are the only ties to her former life (actually, this was Dante's manipulations, which makes Sloth even more lazy for not having a real point-of-view of her own).
If that doesn't work for you, remember that not all the Homunculus' powers fit their name. What does claws have to do with Lust? Where does eye-precognation work with Wrath?
Joined: 29-June 09
Member No.: 69,791
Thanks, Claudius, for clearing that up.
As for the other Homunculi, I could associate their name with some aspect of their character. Lust, Gluttony, Envy, Greed - okay, those are obvious. Wrath the kid - well I dunno, his whining made people get angry? Same for the Fuhrer as Wrath, or as Pride - who made a snide remark to Envy in episode 46 about missing his father. The only thing I could think of for Sloth was something along the lines you mentioned - the brothers created her because they were too "lazy" to go on without her.
Joined: 24-June 10
Member No.: 74,611
Sloth's power evokes the waters of the womb. This becomes implicit when Sloth captures Wrath literally within her own body. That is the start of the adopted mother/son relationship between the two characters, so Sloth provides Wrath's 'second birth' in a sense.
The sin of sloth can be committed by refusing to move on or by trying to go backwards. This is what the Elric brothers did when they tried to bring their mother back: they refused to accept death as a natural part of life and wanted to return to the safety of their past by committing the forbidden. This particular sin is also Sloth's downfall: Wrath became so attached to Sloth that he "never wanted to leave her again" and fused with her... Wrath was essentially committing the same sin as the Elrics, refusing to move beyond his mother and regressing to the safety of his past (or in Wrath's case, returning to the "womb"). It's fitting that Sloth the Homunculus is both created and destroyed through acts of sloth.
Since Sloth and Lust become opposed to each other, the use of liquid contrasts visually with Lust's, um, sharpness. Also, similar to Psiren's dual personalities, there's a major divide between the mother and lover types and the how the two Elric brothers choose to approach them.
Joined: 28-March 06
From: An IKEA box.
Member No.: 33,782
To be honest, I sort of think that the Trisha-homunculus was labelled Sloth because Bones didn’t have any other options (like it was the only sin left, so they just slapped it on her.) I agree with the water theory, and it definitely fits to call her Sloth after she was created out of the Elric's inability to emotionally progress after their mother's death. But while it ties-in nicely, one of the other sins would’ve fitted her just as well if you think about it in the right way, for example, she could’ve been Pride; born from the Elric’s arrogance and belief that they could bypass God’s/nature’s will. Oooh, Can you imagine how delightfully twisted/creepy it would be if she had been Lust?
However, when you think about it, all of the homunculi have characteristics that could apply to any of the sins... Anime-Envy could easily be Wrath. Greed's independence and confidence could label him as Pride. You could strrrretch it and say that anime-Lust has a sort of ENVY for humanity...
Yeah, I just forgot where I was going with this. Anyway.
I always thought it would've made more sense if anime-Wrath had been labelled Sloth, and (perhaps even a little ironic because he was so quick and youthful), like his attachment to the mother-figures (Izumi, Dante, Sloth) could tie into his inability to be independent.
Joined: 12-October 07
From: UK, studying the tea ritual of the natives
Member No.: 52,145
Is there any one person responsible for the alternative storyline the first FMA pursued after it split away from the manga's plot? The ANN profile gave as many as six scriptwriters, but which of these is the person who had the broader vision in creating a new plot for FMA whilst staying true to the overarching themes? Would that be the director?
FMA's entry on TV Tropes' Better Than It Sounds page:
Military specialist searches for a magic rock recipe to get his brother out of a can. In one version of the story, the rock is their father, in the other version the rock is us. Or: Children see a Thing Man Was Not Meant To Know, run around country looking for another one.
Joined: 25-November 08
From: Planet Earth. I think.
Member No.: 64,903
I need help! I'm in a bit of an argument with an FMA fan on another website, and I was wondering if you guys could settle something for me.
As far as I've known (I haven't read all the manga extras or anime guides, so all I have to go on is what I've read on the forums here), the first anime started with the original manga plot, then when they ran out of manga material, Arakawa requested that they make their own plot and ending so her own ending wouldn't be ruined for the manga readers.
But the fan who's arguing with me claims that "the original plot is in the first FMA! Arakawa explains it in Book 8 at the very back! The original plot was the first FMA and after they made the anime she changed her mind!"
Now I've never heard that story before, but I'm willing to be corrected if I'm wrong, and I'd love it if some of you experts could tell me the real facts about this. What really went on with the first anime? What's "Book 8", and what's in the back of it? What, if anything, did Arakawa change her mind about? My head's starting to spin and I'm tired of fighting with this person. >.<
Joined: 21-May 09
From: Yorkshire, UK
Member No.: 68,926
I've never heard anything like that, either.
I've never heard of "book 8" but out of curiosity I took a look at volume 8 and in the back of which she tells the story of how she found out they wanted to make an anime of FMA, and how she helped them out with it. I know I may be very wrong here, but I thought this would all be worth a mention since this person said "book 8" at the back and coincidentally, volume 8 has something about anime 1 at the back.
I just read through it and she mentioned that once she helped them out with the basics the first anime was then just left in the director's, et al, hands. She also says that she told them what happened/would happen in the manga and what would happen at the very end. But then she also states that she didn't even know what was going to happen in the final episode of the first anime. So if this is the material that this person is going by it would stand to reason that, if she didn't know what was going to happen in the final episode, it wasn't the original plot. xD;
So maybe the person you're arguing with read that and got confused? Or maybe there is something called "book 8", because like you, I've never read all of the guides. I hope someone can offer up a better, more informed contribution for you at some point. ><
Joined: 17-September 05
Member No.: 23,115
@Dearheart - As far as I know, there is no official publication of 8th FMA guidebook, if that helps you.
And, as far as Arakawa-sensei's comment at the back of FMA manga Vol. 8, I agree with what A Pierrot's Aria posted above, and it's a good possibility that that's what that person in other forum is referring to you also.
Also, if I may point out additionally, Arakawa-sensei had how she would end FMA manga in her mind more or less from the beginning of FMA manga series. (She stated that in multiple interviews, but I will list one from her interview on September 2003 issue of "ぱふ (pafu)" magazine below. )
荒川：…特にはないですかね。私はストーリーに合わせて役者を連れてくる、みたいな感覚なので、誰は描きにくいというのはないです。 描きやすいといえば、やっぱりエドです。 目的が (Warning! Series final spoiler in Japanese --->)「元の体に戻る」ってハッキリしてるんで。絵的には筋肉少佐（笑）。ストーリーも連載当初から最後まで考えていて、変わったところもないです。
(And yes, that's how she ended the FMA manga, and no, she did not "change her mind.") If so, doesn't that make that (Arakawa-sensei's FMA manga ending) as the original ending?
Anyway, we can't speak for what someone meant in what he/she said in his/her post in some other forum, and hence I think the best way to find out what that person meant is by asking him/her directly what he/she meant by "book 8." And/or, (if what he/she meant by "book 8" is NOT FMA manga vol. 8) maybe you can ask him/her to post Arakawa-sensei's quote from that "book 8", if possible, so that you can read exactly what Arakawa-sensei said, instead of going by that person's personal interpretation of her words.
If /when you find out, please post back here and let us know.
Joined: 25-December 11
Member No.: 87,826
Hello FMA Forums. I do not watch Full Metal Alchemist. But I require your assistance with the lore of "transmutation circles." A month or so ago, this not so big game called The Elder Scrolls: Skyrim was released. Some of you may play it, some of you may not. However, the very smart people over at the Skyrim subreddit of Reddit.com (who happen to be FMA fans) have discovered that there might be a transmutation circle spanning a whole province. We know a little bit, but we still need to know more about this easter egg, because it might be reveal the next plot point for a DLC. Right now, I need to know if this is a Transmutation Circle. If it is, I need to know the details of how one goes along transmuting. We know it requires massacres and sacrifice. Here is the thread on Reddit if anyone wants to read. Thanks so much! PS here is a second pic of the transmutation circle:
Joined: 25-December 11
Member No.: 87,833
well, no one else has replied, so i made an account to respond. it is a transmutation circle, derived from one used to resurrect the dead. it doesnt actually work in the series, and instead maims the user as a "price," granting large amounts of or all knowledge, and then creating a homunculi, a demon type thing that looks like the person the user was trying to resurrect and is pretty much evil. yeah.
Joined: 28-December 11
Member No.: 87,869
Hey, I was brought here by your comment on reddit, and the problem with the transmutation circle theory (which I believe is the best theory yet proposed, especially given another page which shows a solar eclipse), is that in the diagram of the second pic of the previously proposed pentagon is just that, a pentagon. The transmutation circle is a hexagon. So I think that the pentagon theory may be flawed, and we need to look for a new, hexagonal shape.
Joined: 17-September 05
Member No.: 23,115
Welcome to our board, nightrunner_ks, and that's an intriguing question, and thank you for the help, Leprechaun and Leprechaun! I agree that, although some other transmutation circles with pentagon is theoretically possible, I think, the transmutation circle used in the series was a hexagon shape, and therefore some other explanation may be needed?