HAGANE NO RENKINJUTSUSHI
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Episode 54: Beyond The Inferno - Content Discussion Thread, Warning, possible spoilers for the first 54 episodes
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Chiyo
post Apr 24 2010, 12:29 PM
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Talk-back/content discussion for English dubbed episode on Adult Swim starts on page 5. smile.gif


Please post the discussions on the content of episode 54 here.
This thread is declared as a Spoiler zone for the content of the first 54 episodes.

Please don't ask for links on where to watch this episode, raw or subbed. Discussions on 'where to watch' belong in Where/How to Watch FMA Series 2. Don't post screencaps unless highlighting something important about the content of the episode. Just like on in most area's of the board, avoid one line posts, spam of any kind or conversations between two members.

Screenshots: see Omni's post.

Summary: Riza tricks a Roy-disguised Envy into giving himself away, and fires at him repeatedly. He manages to gain the advantage over her, but Roy arrives and continues attacking him viciously with his flames. Envy's body begins to decompose as his embryonic form tries to escape, but is trapped under Roy's foot. Riza points her gun at the real Roy, however, refusing to let him surrender to his rage in revenge. Edward and Scar arrive, and Ed takes posession of Envy, with Roy threatening him. Ed, Scar, and Riza talk him down from his madness, which surprises Envy. Envy tries to rile them up against each other, but is unable to. Edward suggests that Envy is jealous of humans, of how they help each other and endure crises. Outraged and humiliated, Envy commits suicide. Meanwhile, the Armstrong siblings continue to fight Sloth, with Alex tricking Sloth into slamming his arm back into place, and then plummeling him repeatedly and using his alchemy. The Briggs troops attack the front gate, leading the commander in charge to order firing at the unevacuated areas, but before he can complete the command, Buccaneer arrives to stop him, as does Falman, and Izumi Curtis. Deep underground, Hohenheim confronts Father, formerly the Dwarf in the Flask.
- © Penguintruth, used with permission

*WARNING*

I will not tolerate anyone ignoring the rules. I will make these clear and simple;

-Do not spam.
-Add spoiler tags to spoilers
-Do not go off topic
-Do not fight

Spam means one line posts that contain little content. "OMG that ep was so cool" would be an example of spam. If you enjoyed the episode please specify what you enjoyed so much, was there anything you didn't like?

Spoilers mean anything you know will happen in upcoming episodes. Not everybody reads the manga and you may reveal something they didn't know. For future episode discussion, please go to the relevant topic. If you are unsure how to use spoiler tags, please ask.

Going off topic means discussing a characters actions outside of the episode, or talking about the artwork, or upcoming episodes etc. I know this can happen easily so don't be upset if I move your posts or guide you in the right direction. Double check the forum for the right place to take your post.

Everybody can voice their opinion, and nobody is correct just as nobody is incorrect. Because none of you will spam (right?) people will justify why they didn't like something. You are welcome to say "well I like that part because..." but you CAN NOT say "no you are wrong because..."

I don't like to start a thread so negatively but I want to stop these things before they happen. Please ensure this is the only time I have to mention these rules.


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Kyelinn
post Apr 26 2010, 07:27 AM
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When you're in the military, you HAVE NO CHOICE. You can't just quit the military either. He was part of the military, he'd just become a state alchemist and not ONCE did I say he was young! WTF And I never once said it was an excuse for murder. The military says jump and you say how high. That's the way it is. It is NO different than the US military fighting to protect it's people. That doesn't mean it's RIGHT nor is it justified. I don't like it, I think it's wrong, but Mustang had no choice. He was part of the Isvhal extermination whether he liked it or not. He was a soldier and he had a responsibility to the military. It's no different than a US soldier being ordered to kill whatever countries we've been at war with.


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Goral
post Apr 26 2010, 08:31 AM
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@Kyelinn

Let me rephrase then, you were making excuses for him when he fried innocent people. To me it's trying to justify him but if you prefer I can call it "making excuses". You were trying to invalidate my argument by making his war crime less serious. "He was made to do it". "He didn't enjoy it". "He was in the military". Seriously, how would you name it if not "justifying"?
- You killed him.
- He pulled his gun first.
I would call it justifying.

- You killed them.
- I was ordered to.
Likewise.

Anyway, what difference does it make that he was in a military? It's better if thousands of people die then me, right? I can give a hand in a genocide if I'm being ordered to, right?
I know soldier cannot resign without consequences and I know that trial would wait for him. The problem was it was clear who was aggressor and who was a victim here. Who had superior power and who didn't stand a chance. Roy was kicking the lying (on the ground). And Alex Armstrong somehow survived after disobeying orders. He even became a major.

As for you not saying he was young. Is he old according to you or what? I don't get it.
QUOTE (Kyelinn @ Apr 26 2010, 02:53 PM) *
As for Ishval, Roy had only just become a state alchemist and only just began working for the military if I'm not mistaken.

We know Roy is now 30, in Ishbal he was about 10 years younger. Why did you even mention it if not to emphasize the fact he was still a young rookie? Either you mentioned him because you wanted to make your post longer or it was supposed to be an argument that his lack of experience led to a series of wrong decisions. Or could you elaborate and explain what you meant?

I'm not thinking poorly of FMA, only this particular part. It should be obvious by now, I was active in manga thread after all and most of the time praised Arakawa. The only time I did the opposite was in the 94th thread. And I'm not causing trouble but expressing my opinion. Since you're replying to my post, I'm replying to yours. You don't want me to reply then don't reply, easy as that.

And yes, Mustang is a character that Arakawa can do whatever she desires with it. But there is sth called consistency. If Mustang changed after killing Envy it would mean Arakawa was being inconsistent and everything we knew about him before was gibberish. All in all Mustang did not kill Envy and we have no means to know "what would happen if". But since Scar somehow changed for the better what makes you think that Mustang would not? And let me remind you that Scar killed not one but several people out of his revenge. PEOPLE not worms (unless you're saying that Envy was a human). Mustang wouldn't even kill his own species but some animal that had to be put down anyway.

Killing innocent people and not changing for worse and Scar changing for better only support my opinion. Against it is that Ed (that is a kid and didn't experience what Mustang did), Scar (whose case I've already discussed about) and Riza feared it would change him and we might think that it was Arakawa's words themselves (and by that I mean her personal belief not only character's). But as I said, it would only show Arakawa's inconsistency.

@Jealous Rogo
Teenagers are not children? O_O Maybe 17-19 not (although I could argue with that) but below?

Sure he has to pay, war is bad, etc., but that is beyond my point which is: Mustang didn't become a bad person. He wants to pay for what he had done and that's honourable of him but what I was trying to say was that killing Envy wouldn't change him since killing innocent people didn't change him. And why would one act scratch everything what he's done so far? There are no perfect people. People feel anger. I don't see a problem with Mustang killing Envy and still becoming a good leader, there is no conflict here.


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Posts in this topic
- Chiyo   Episode 54: Beyond The Inferno - Content Discussion Thread   Apr 24 2010, 12:29 PM
- - Michiyo-   - We waited so long for the “Burn my back” scene. ...   Apr 25 2010, 01:29 AM
- - penguintruth   My initial thoughts: - Oh look, a scene we should...   Apr 25 2010, 01:32 AM
- - black~hayate   Wahahahahaha! That was awesome! The wait w...   Apr 25 2010, 01:38 AM
|- - Omni   Episode 54 Screencaps and Impressions QUOTE (blac...   Apr 25 2010, 02:33 AM
- - shanryelric   ok. first of all, I almost cry because of the crac...   Apr 25 2010, 01:43 AM
- - Kaori Ayanami   Holy smokes! I saw this episode subbed! Ye...   Apr 25 2010, 01:50 AM
- - SneakyRuler   - Ishbal, at last. A few more good flashbacks like...   Apr 25 2010, 01:56 AM
- - amestris_star   Such a beautiful episode <3 All the Roy-Riza in...   Apr 25 2010, 02:59 AM
|- - Claudius   So they added Hughes to this scene? Chapter 95 gen...   Apr 25 2010, 04:22 AM
- - Jealous Rogo   QUOTE (Claudius @ Apr 25 2010, 05:22 AM) ...   Apr 25 2010, 04:57 AM
- - fma_milan_freak   Well . . Claudius . . I can't help you wit the...   Apr 25 2010, 05:04 AM
|- - Claudius   Look, I'm not arguing that Roy should never ha...   Apr 25 2010, 08:00 AM
- - Vicious74   Lol @ people thinking Envy's jealousy of human...   Apr 25 2010, 08:15 AM
- - Broken Chouchou   QUOTE (Mr. Deathy @ Apr 25 2010, 06:17 PM...   Apr 25 2010, 08:53 AM
- - Mr. Deathy   This has to be one of the best executed episodes i...   Apr 25 2010, 09:17 AM
- - TheSentinel   Good episode. I really liked how the animation tu...   Apr 25 2010, 09:42 AM
- - Bag of Magic Food   I thought Homunculus's voice was more entertai...   Apr 25 2010, 10:46 AM
- - A Pierrot's Aria   I thought this episode was brilliant- one of the b...   Apr 25 2010, 10:50 AM
- - Megabyte117   Great episode. Despite being previously upset when...   Apr 25 2010, 10:50 AM
- - Chiyo   Before we get too off topic, please carry on the d...   Apr 25 2010, 10:58 AM
- - FailToImpress   Gahhh, so emotional! One of the best episodes ...   Apr 25 2010, 11:18 AM
|- - Mr. Deathy   QUOTE (FailToImpress @ Apr 25 2010, 11:18...   Apr 25 2010, 12:00 PM
- - fma_milan_freak   Watched the raw and i have to admit that it was a ...   Apr 25 2010, 12:09 PM
- - Jealous Rogo   QUOTE (Vicious74 @ Apr 25 2010, 09:15 AM)...   Apr 25 2010, 12:11 PM
- - EveningAlchemist   It may just be because I'm having a sick day, ...   Apr 25 2010, 02:05 PM
- - deet-tastic   I've been waiting for this episode since Novem...   Apr 25 2010, 02:35 PM
- - FailToImpress   QUOTE (Mr. Deathy @ Apr 25 2010, 08:00 PM...   Apr 25 2010, 03:12 PM
- - Neurotripsy   As an Envy fan I was dreading this episode & i...   Apr 25 2010, 04:42 PM
- - Goral   Everything below is my opinion and I won't add...   Apr 26 2010, 01:38 AM
- - Kyelinn   Because he would be killing Envy for revenge for E...   Apr 26 2010, 05:53 AM
- - Broken Chouchou   Let me just point out, Goral, that all the killing...   Apr 26 2010, 07:11 AM
- - Goral   @Kyelinn You were trying to justify what Mustang d...   Apr 26 2010, 07:21 AM
|- - Kaori Ayanami   Please... Let's take into account that Arakawa...   Apr 27 2010, 03:38 PM
- - Jealous Rogo   QUOTE (Goral @ Apr 26 2010, 08:21 AM) You...   Apr 26 2010, 07:53 AM
- - Vagrant   The art looked really crisp to me in this episode....   Apr 26 2010, 08:20 AM
|- - Bag of Magic Food   Probably because most of the times somebody starts...   Apr 26 2010, 04:42 PM
- - Chiyo   Thank-you for ignoring me and continuing to bicker...   Apr 26 2010, 10:04 AM
- - deet-tastic   Yeah, instead of returning like Breda and Fuery, F...   Apr 26 2010, 05:42 PM
- - JELEE   Loooooooooove it when people say they're just ...   Apr 27 2010, 01:23 AM
- - Kyelinn   I really could care less if somebody doesn't a...   Apr 27 2010, 06:33 AM
- - Goral   I have an advice to you Kyelinn. Don't reply t...   Apr 27 2010, 07:32 AM
|- - Kyelinn   QUOTE (Goral @ Apr 27 2010, 09:32 AM) I h...   Apr 27 2010, 12:35 PM
- - Broken Chouchou   QUOTE (Goral @ Apr 26 2010, 05:31 PM) If ...   Apr 27 2010, 07:57 AM
|- - Jealous Rogo   Okay actually sat doiwn and watched the ep and... ...   Apr 27 2010, 09:18 AM
|- - Vicious74   QUOTE (Jealous Rogo @ Apr 27 2010, 05:18 ...   Apr 27 2010, 03:58 PM
- - IceSkadi   QUOTE (Jealous Rogo @ Apr 27 2010, 06:18 ...   Apr 27 2010, 09:49 AM
- - deet-tastic   Back on topic now.. Some of the camera angles did...   Apr 27 2010, 03:17 PM
- - Hagaren_4ever   Goral, you bring up many valid points, and I respe...   Apr 27 2010, 04:46 PM
- - JELEE   You cant tell people not to respond to your own po...   Apr 27 2010, 10:57 PM
|- - Claudius   Y'know in my review of the manga chapter, I wr...   Apr 29 2010, 06:41 PM
- - deet-tastic   Excellent points bringing up Henry VIII and Caesar...   Apr 29 2010, 09:04 PM
|- - Mr. Deathy   QUOTE (deet-tastic @ Apr 29 2010, 09...   May 2 2010, 12:59 AM
- - theanimalmafia   Some thoughts: -I gotta say, man, the art was rea...   Apr 30 2010, 08:52 PM
|- - Bag of Magic Food   QUOTE (theanimalmafia @ Apr 30 2010, 09:5...   Apr 30 2010, 09:27 PM
- - penguintruth   I rolled my eyes at how painfully dragged out the ...   Apr 30 2010, 09:36 PM
- - Green Eyed Envy   I've been trying to post here for a while. ...   May 2 2010, 12:53 PM
- - Michiyo-   Please add FMA:B English dubbed episode 54 (on CN ...   Jul 16 2011, 02:30 PM
- - Puka-chan   Travis did just a great job as Roy but Colleen and...   Jul 17 2011, 02:52 AM
- - Dark-Winds   I must say, one of the things that stood out to me...   Jul 17 2011, 09:45 AM
- - Tombow   I loved this episode! This episode tops even l...   Jul 17 2011, 11:13 AM
- - Heza   Dang, Colleen did beautifully at the beginning for...   Jul 17 2011, 11:39 AM
- - MustangSally   See it's funny because I actually thought the ...   Jul 17 2011, 07:03 PM
- - ~LilianaDC~   (Warning: truly sorry for my bad English, since I...   Sep 13 2011, 03:48 AM
- - Tombow   For anyone who missed this episode, it will be on ...   Oct 13 2012, 01:33 PM
- - Tombow   For anyone who missed this episode, it will be on ...   Nov 23 2013, 07:50 PM


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