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51 And Beyond, Final episodes and possible sequel
Fresh_Coffee
post Jan 14 2005, 08:08 PM
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Wow I have never even thought about stuff like that. Post more of your theories!


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jessin
post Jan 15 2005, 03:45 PM
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Guest_Guest_*
post Jan 15 2005, 03:50 PM
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QUOTE(jessin @ Jan 15 2005, 03:45 PM)
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Incredible theory. I agree with the whole "world splitting up after the creation of the Philospopher's stone" thing. That could explain why we see archaeological evidence all over the world of people who never met attempting alchemy.

I mean just think about it. People were researching alchemy up until Issac Newton's time and the early 1800s (Newton himself dabbled a bit in alchemy and supposedly got mercury poisoning.) The egyptians, too, were looking into it. That's easily over 3,000 years of people who were born at different times, at different places, and all looking for the same exact thing.

maybe alchemy does exist in the "real world" but people have forgotten it. Maybe Ed doesn't have to resort to the whole "space time continum"/ rocket thing.

meh....head hurts....  blink.gif

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jessin
post Jan 15 2005, 03:55 PM
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QUOTE(Guest @ Jan 15 2005, 03:50 PM)
QUOTE(jessin @ Jan 15 2005, 03:45 PM)
Spoiler: (Click here to Display)
Incredible theory. I agree with the whole "world splitting up after the creation of the Philospopher's stone" thing. That could explain why we see archaeological evidence all over the world of people who never met attempting alchemy.

I mean just think about it. People were researching alchemy up until Issac Newton's time and the early 1800s (Newton himself dabbled a bit in alchemy and supposedly got mercury poisoning.) The egyptians, too, were looking into it. That's easily over 3,000 years of people who were born at different times, at different places, and all looking for the same exact thing.

maybe alchemy does exist in the "real world" but people have forgotten it. Maybe Ed doesn't have to resort to the whole "space time continum"/ rocket thing.

meh....head hurts....  blink.gif

Spoiler: (Click here to Display)
Well the thing is.. that alchemy in our world never worked like it did in the series and its not that people have forgoten about it...Chemistry and Physics took over it becuase it was more accurete than alchemy.

to make myself clear, i wasn't talking about the present day world now. I was referring to the world on the other side of the gate in the series. sorry if you didn't understand.

but if that world is kinda like our world, then it would have the same history.


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Phoenix_alchemis...
post Jan 15 2005, 06:05 PM
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I read somewhere that the two major reasons alchemy in our world was abandoned was:

1. The advent of the scientfic process made thing safer and more accurate
2. The supposed miracle longivity potions (or Philosopher's stones) killed most of the people they were tested on.

Of course, our world didn't have alchemy where you just clap your hands or draw a circle and POOF, somthing else gets created.


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jessin
post Jan 15 2005, 06:14 PM
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QUOTE(Phoenix_alchemist @ Jan 15 2005, 06:05 PM)
I read somewhere that the two major reasons alchemy in our world was abandoned was:

1. The advent of the scientfic process made thing safer and more accurate
2. The supposed miracle longivity potions (or Philosopher's stones) killed most of the people they were tested on.

Of course, our world didn't have alchemy where you just clap your hands or draw a circle and POOF, somthing else gets created.

also, people were burned at the stake by the church.

There is no POOF, but Ed still has a way to get around the laws of science.

I can't wait till I can see this film. biggrin.gif


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swtdrmzx99x
post Jan 15 2005, 08:19 PM
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QUOTE(keske @ Jan 14 2005, 01:46 AM)
This thread contains spoilers. I will not be hung, drawn, or quartered for your reckless curiosity.

Spoiler: (Click here to Display)
There are several theories pertaining 鋼之鍊金術師's world, and a popularly-held belief is that the world of alchemy is an alternate universe that somehow forked from our world, or one that is related to our world.  The basis for this conclusion? We know that Christianity had existed once in the world of alchemy and we are told that the religion has been dead for over 400 years.

But knowing that Christianity has been dead for over 400 years in the world of 鋼之鍊金術師, consider the fact that the Hohenheim and Dante are at least 400 years old. In fact, we know that Hohenheim and Date were persecuted by the Church. Was it coincidence or was there something more to it?  Did the creation of the Philosopher's Stone distort what we now believe is real? Could it be that the Philosopher's Stone split reality into two dimensions? After all, why does alchemy exist in one world but the other depends on technology?

Recall the scene with the gate in episode 49. As Ed passes through time and space and goes into "truth vision" mode, we see lots of images: dinosaurs, World War I blimps, World War II Japanese troops, the detonation of the atom bomb, a United States flag, 天安門/Tiananmen Square,  毛澤東/Mao Zedong, the World Trade Center ruins, scenes from 鋼之鍊金術師 that are out of place, and events that have not even happened yet. According to the subs from Shinsen-Sonchou, Hohenheim says that alchemy is powered by the lives of people from our world (hereafter "real world").   Is it possible that cataclysmic events such as wars, 9/11, the Asian tsunami, and so forth power alchemy, while we depend on raw energy and fuel sources (as automail does not work in the real world)? Is that the truth behind truths?




  • Dante and Hohenheim were both in a world which Christianity had still existed, and we are told of witchhunts and some sort of plague.



  • The Philosopher's Stone was made by Dante and Hohenheim; soon, Christianity falls out of existence.



  • Based on Dante's love letter, it's been over 400 years since the Philosopher's Stone was made, and the world has moved onto some sort of industrial age.



  • Within 400 years, Christianity lost its believers,  the industrial revolution occurred, and the Philosopher's Stone was created over and over again.



Conclusion: We don't know enough yet. I like to believe that Shambala/Paradise has something to do with this, such as linking the two universes. For one thing, the creation of the Philosopher's Stone requires the ability to use alchemy. But perhaps pre-Philosopher's Stone, people were able to use alchemy in the "real world." Perhaps there was only one world (and thus explains the miracles of Jesus Christ). Perhaps only Dante (or Hohenheim) knows ...

Anyway, I wrote this on cold medicine. I might just be overanalyzing. Excuse the rambling.  blink.gif

OUCH! my head... haha, but it makes a lot of sense!
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keske
post Jan 15 2005, 08:43 PM
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QUOTE(jessin @ Jan 15 2005, 03:55 PM)
QUOTE(Guest @ Jan 15 2005, 03:50 PM)
QUOTE(jessin @ Jan 15 2005, 03:45 PM)
Spoiler: (Click here to Display)
Incredible theory. I agree with the whole "world splitting up after the creation of the Philospopher's stone" thing. That could explain why we see archaeological evidence all over the world of people who never met attempting alchemy.

I mean just think about it. People were researching alchemy up until Issac Newton's time and the early 1800s (Newton himself dabbled a bit in alchemy and supposedly got mercury poisoning.) The egyptians, too, were looking into it. That's easily over 3,000 years of people who were born at different times, at different places, and all looking for the same exact thing.

maybe alchemy does exist in the "real world" but people have forgotten it. Maybe Ed doesn't have to resort to the whole "space time continum"/ rocket thing.

meh....head hurts....  blink.gif

Spoiler: (Click here to Display)
Well the thing is.. that alchemy in our world never worked like it did in the series and its not that people have forgoten about it...Chemistry and Physics took over it becuase it was more accurete than alchemy.

to make myself clear, i wasn't talking about the present day world now. I was referring to the world on the other side of the gate in the series. sorry if you didn't understand.

but if that world is kinda like our world, then it would have the same history.

What I would like to know from the movie is what the Thule Society, the notorious forerunner of the Nazi party, is doing with Hohenheim. It does make sense, though, since the organization was involved with Nazi mysticism--and in fact alchemy--they would support the genocide of a race (anti-Semiticism) to produce a Philosopher's Stone.

However, a few things make this theory less believable. Ed would have to be at least 30 years old to see the Nazi party involved with their atrocities. Furthermore, alchemy does not work or does not work in the same sense it does in the world of 鋼之鍊金術師. Perhaps "magic" is the so-called polar opposite of alchemy, since "magic" is often considered less accurate and in many cases ignores the principle of equivalent trade.
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Jacen
post Jan 16 2005, 06:42 PM
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my brain hurts dry.gif too many theories... that only leaves one question, what is the truth of truths? Nobody may ever find out.
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ZeeDeveel
post Jan 16 2005, 07:34 PM
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[FONT=Arial][COLOR=gray] I love reading these theories. I hope the movie incorporates some of them, and expands upon it. I know it won't be likely anyway, but I'm really hoping they won't make the movie only to satisfy the semi-emptiness lots of people felt after the show ended with the separation of Ed and Al.

I'm hoping for some good storyline.. just like the series had. Eh, two hours to do it, but I hope it turns out great.





But then again.. the movie won't come out in America for another gazillion years. sleep.gif

Maybe I'll go to Japan this summer O_O





Pardon my random, and trailed off thoughts.


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ZeeDeveel
post Jan 16 2005, 07:35 PM
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I love reading these theories. I hope the movie incorporates some of them, and expands upon it. I know it won't be likely anyway, but I'm really hoping they won't make the movie only to satisfy the semi-emptiness lots of people felt after the show ended with the separation of Ed and Al.

I'm hoping for some good storyline.. just like the series had. Eh, two hours to do it, but I hope it turns out great.





But then again.. the movie won't come out in America for another gazillion years. sleep.gif

Maybe I'll go to Japan this summer O_O





Pardon my random, and trailed off thoughts.


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Jacen
post Jan 16 2005, 10:07 PM
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double post! omg!!!11!!1one1!SHIFT!

yeah the theories are interesting but i read them right after i finished watching 51 for the first time and i got a headache. lol serves me right brain overload.
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ZeeDeveel
post Jan 16 2005, 11:35 PM
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Haha sorry for the double post, but I'm a new kiddo here. I thought when you edit, it fixes your post, but... I learned that it just reposts it O_O.

Yeah. What I love about the anime, though, is how there's such an overload of information and storyline in it that it is so re-watchable. I was sitting at my computer yesterday thinking I'd see an episode I remember liking, only to find myself 2 hours later wondering why I kept watching. Haha.



And I repeat that I hope the movie does the anime justice.


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TheVileOne
post Jan 17 2005, 12:09 AM
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Here's the thing though. If Christianity totally fell out, why was Psiren dressed up as a Roman Catholic nun in episode 10?


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Queen of the dam...
post Jan 17 2005, 02:35 AM
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Has anyone thought who that wierd guy in a mask in the trailer is? Think it could be Dante in disguise....


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