HAGANE NO RENKINJUTSUSHI
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Episode 3: City Of Heresy - Content Discussion Thread, Warning! Possible spoilers for the first 3 episodes!
Trakonda
post Apr 20 2009, 03:44 AM
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QUOTE (Edamame @ Apr 20 2009, 11:56 AM) *
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It's interesting to hear people say that this series seems shallow and the humor a little overdone. I think it really all depends on what you think the FMA series is about. FMA:B isn't a character-driven philosophical drama like FMA1-- it's much closer to the tone of the manga, which I think will always be a relative of the shounen genre. Wacky humor and heavy action has always been a part of shounen, so I don't feel weird when I watch super deformed Ed and Al, and rejoice that there's finally some more humorous/silly moments in the anime. FMA isn't as shallow as Naruto or Bleach, of course, but the archetypical shounen theme of finding the strength to overcome all obstacles really rings true in FMA, and it's something that the director has expressed when asked to sum up the feel of FMA. I completely agree with the poster who said earlier that FMA is really just a good balance between the light-hearted and the heavy moments. It's certainly more intellectually-driven than most any shounen series, as well.


I must say that I couldn´t agree with you more. I adore both the original work of Arakawa-sensei, and the original series. However, I do find that the tone between both of these works diverges a great deal, as do the central themes. I agree that Arakawa-sensei´s work is incredibly intellectually-driven and has an extreme amount of depth in comparison to other shounen series. (There are other shounen manga series out there, with a great deal of substance that makes you think.) Yet, the author still retains the humour, the action, and many of the themes central in shounen manga that generally target one´s personal will to continue onward and overcome obstacles. I always viewed the central themes in Arakawa-sensei´s manga as movement and personal growth. The origina anime series always seemed so much darker in tone and tackled much more philosophical themes such as the nature of man, the fight between good and evil, and a slew of other heavy-handed subjects. One of the central themes in the original series was that of brotherhood, which was exemplified in the characters of Edward and Alphonse. While Edward and Alphonse are extremely loyal to one another in the manga, we do see times when they are seperated and one their own. I always found this so much more realistic, because it lets the reader comprehend that although the brothers are a team in every sense of the word, they will not always be together. There are times in life that we are seperated from the ones we love, and forced to embark on our own personal journies.

I believe that the anime will center much more on the themes of movement and growth (interpret this as you will) and overcoming hardship, grief, and personal loss. Many of the characters in the manga are on their own personal journey, and attempt to move forward in order to obtain it. I know that in the manga we have seen Ed grow from a cocky and rather self-centered teenager to a young man who is strong-willed and resolute, undyling loyal, and who shares an unbreakable bond with his brother. I agree that the tone is the manga is much more "hopeful": "Yes, I can overcome hardship and pain and move forward to achieve my goal." Hopefully, the directors will be able to capture this in the new series.


I couldn't have said it any better. Well done! biggrin.gif

Season 1 was darker-themed and seemed to circle around all the sadness and loss. As watching that for 51 episodes, I really was hoping that the new season would take a different view - the Arakawa's style of view. I think Bones is doing great job so far! smile.gif

I can't help but love all the humor scenes. Every single one of them. I watched the subbed episode last night, and you can't tell how happy I felt after seeing it. It had it's sad themes (the scene with Rose and Ed was definitely emotional, I loved that. ) but still it showed that while things are how they are now, there's always a linger of hope, somewhere.

..English is not my native language, so I can't explain my view as deeply as most people do. Hope it's still making sense, though! happy.gif

..I really wish I could get a gif animation of the running scene when Ed and Al (with Rose) ran away from Cornello and his minions through the hall. That looked just adorable! XD
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Sannom
post Apr 20 2009, 04:21 AM
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QUOTE
I can't help but love all the humor scenes. Every single one of them.


The one with Rose saying "By praying, you could get taller" was overkill though... in the manga, it made sense because Rose saw Ed's antics about that, but here it really comes of nowhere huh.gif
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FailToImpress
post Apr 20 2009, 04:44 AM
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I liked this episode... smile.gif It's really hard not to automatically compare it to its counterpart from the first series but I found this adaptation to be a lot better. I like Rose more too, last series I just couldn't stand her, and as a small note, I like that they've toned down the colour of the pink in her hair.

It looks like they're slowing with the pace as well, which I know is something that annoyed a lot of people with the first two episodes.

Episode 4 looks good too. wink.gif
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Meu
post Apr 20 2009, 06:06 AM
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Agh, too much short jokes for one episode. >_< They don't have to have that thing with people thinking Al is the Fullmetal alchemist in every damn scene.
They could've had e.g. Rose just shoot Al without Ed making a scene; it didn't make sense that the brothers made Ed the target since shooting Al doesn't have any effect on him. And we would've gotten a more dramatic moment. smile.gif
And I didn't like the split-screens, looked messy.

Otherwise the episode was pretty good. It was way slower compared to the previous ones (yet still fast) and I was very pleased until the Hulk Cornello thing, but I'll just pretend it never happened. :] Loved the evil smirk on Ed's face when he transmuted his automail into the scary-looking blade and his laugh when he had tricked Cornello, plus I cracked up to Ed and Al running in the church thingy with Rose. It looked funny. ^^'
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Cece
post Apr 20 2009, 08:06 AM
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QUOTE (WinterChanterelle @ Apr 20 2009, 06:20 AM) *
This episode also made me happy, because in it, we see manga Ed. I rejoice at seeing the angsty, woe-is-me, FMA1!Ed gone. Manga Ed is a devious, manipulative and extremely clever and talented kid, who - as other people before me have pointed out - has great character growth. FMA1 Ed never felt like much of a genius to me - we rarely see him act clever. We see him fight and rush into situations, but, apart from the manga moment with Yoki in Youswell, he's not the brightest bulb in the box when it comes to getting what he wants/ dealing with people/ life in general. Manga Ed, on the other hand, I trust to find a way out of any situation he gets himself into - and it's great to see him animated. That utterly unimpressed expression when Cornello goes on his take-over-the-world spiel and the devious one after? The reaction to the fake stone shattering? The wonderful face he pulls when transmuting his arm into a crazy blade? The conversation with Rose at the end? I feel that this character is alive. And fun to watch =) Because he'll spend more time actually moving forward than angsting, which is always a good thing in my book.

And yeah, of course I'm projecting a lot of what I already know about manga Ed onto this FMA2 one, but the signs are there. And they make me very happy.


I agree you took the words out of my mouth.


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Makika
post Apr 20 2009, 10:02 AM
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Well, I like the ep in a general mode...

But I think they put some short jokes, making the scenes a little bit forced.
Anyway, the fight with Cornello, the homunculi's part, Ed's laugh and some other things make
it a good episode.

Own, next chapter'll be good, Military dogs *-*
Roy, Riza, Havoc, Breda, Fuery, Fallman, Hughes *-* Own, I want.


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Full Metal Elf
post Apr 20 2009, 10:13 AM
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QUOTE (Trakonda @ Apr 20 2009, 06:44 AM) *
QUOTE (Edamame @ Apr 20 2009, 11:56 AM) *
QUOTE
It's interesting to hear people say that this series seems shallow and the humor a little overdone. I think it really all depends on what you think the FMA series is about. FMA:B isn't a character-driven philosophical drama like FMA1-- it's much closer to the tone of the manga, which I think will always be a relative of the shounen genre. Wacky humor and heavy action has always been a part of shounen, so I don't feel weird when I watch super deformed Ed and Al, and rejoice that there's finally some more humorous/silly moments in the anime. FMA isn't as shallow as Naruto or Bleach, of course, but the archetypical shounen theme of finding the strength to overcome all obstacles really rings true in FMA, and it's something that the director has expressed when asked to sum up the feel of FMA. I completely agree with the poster who said earlier that FMA is really just a good balance between the light-hearted and the heavy moments. It's certainly more intellectually-driven than most any shounen series, as well.


I must say that I couldn´t agree with you more. I adore both the original work of Arakawa-sensei, and the original series. However, I do find that the tone between both of these works diverges a great deal, as do the central themes. I agree that Arakawa-sensei´s work is incredibly intellectually-driven and has an extreme amount of depth in comparison to other shounen series. (There are other shounen manga series out there, with a great deal of substance that makes you think.) Yet, the author still retains the humour, the action, and many of the themes central in shounen manga that generally target one´s personal will to continue onward and overcome obstacles. I always viewed the central themes in Arakawa-sensei´s manga as movement and personal growth. The origina anime series always seemed so much darker in tone and tackled much more philosophical themes such as the nature of man, the fight between good and evil, and a slew of other heavy-handed subjects. One of the central themes in the original series was that of brotherhood, which was exemplified in the characters of Edward and Alphonse. While Edward and Alphonse are extremely loyal to one another in the manga, we do see times when they are seperated and one their own. I always found this so much more realistic, because it lets the reader comprehend that although the brothers are a team in every sense of the word, they will not always be together. There are times in life that we are seperated from the ones we love, and forced to embark on our own personal journies.

I believe that the anime will center much more on the themes of movement and growth (interpret this as you will) and overcoming hardship, grief, and personal loss. Many of the characters in the manga are on their own personal journey, and attempt to move forward in order to obtain it. I know that in the manga we have seen Ed grow from a cocky and rather self-centered teenager to a young man who is strong-willed and resolute, undyling loyal, and who shares an unbreakable bond with his brother. I agree that the tone is the manga is much more "hopeful": "Yes, I can overcome hardship and pain and move forward to achieve my goal." Hopefully, the directors will be able to capture this in the new series.


I couldn't have said it any better. Well done! biggrin.gif

Season 1 was darker-themed and seemed to circle around all the sadness and loss. As watching that for 51 episodes, I really was hoping that the new season would take a different view - the Arakawa's style of view. I think Bones is doing great job so far! smile.gif

I can't help but love all the humor scenes. Every single one of them. I watched the subbed episode last night, and you can't tell how happy I felt after seeing it. It had it's sad themes (the scene with Rose and Ed was definitely emotional, I loved that. ) but still it showed that while things are how they are now, there's always a linger of hope, somewhere.

..English is not my native language, so I can't explain my view as deeply as most people do. Hope it's still making sense, though! happy.gif

..I really wish I could get a gif animation of the running scene when Ed and Al (with Rose) ran away from Cornello and his minions through the hall. That looked just adorable! XD


I agree with you both completely. You captured the theme and tone of what the manga is about in great words.

I was not too sure I'd enjoy the new series when I watched the first episode...but now, 3 episodes in I'm pretty sure it's going to head in the direction I want it to.

I simply hope they don't make unnecessary changes that will keep it from being "manga-strict" like I (or we) thought it would be.

As of now, I have to rate FMA as:

1. Manga
2. FMA2: Brotherhood
2. FMA 1

I love FMA 1...but I have high hopes in this series and if it follows the path of the manga, it will be better than the last IMO.


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Hagaren_4ever
post Apr 20 2009, 02:32 PM
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Seriously, though! I never thought that Rose was ever dark-skinned! Someone enlighten me to the situation at hand. T_T


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Anakishi
post Apr 20 2009, 02:48 PM
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I just want to say I agree with every single word that Haineko, Edamame and WinterChanterelle have said. Thanks a lot, guys: being english not my native language, I find it almost impossible to translate my exact thoughts, but you guys said it all for me! happy.gif

I was so pleased to see a selfish, arrogant teenager-Ed as he was in the beginning of the story: to think that he will slowly grow to that adult-Ed we see in recent manga chapters just kills me of joy. I also think FMA-2 will be more centered on moving forward and character-growing. FMA-1 was awesome at portraying the dark scenes and the angst, but it was just too negative for the original FMA plot, and it looked like it was centered on the past, not the future. I set my hopes up for a more light-hearted (that includes silly jokes) and positive-thinking plot for this new FMA.

The episode was rather good, kinda WTF'd when Cornello told Rose to shoot the Elrics, but after that thought "wow, that matches perfectly". Hulk!Cornello would make a good videogame boss, IMO. tongue.gif
I honestly couldn't find any major elements to complain about. Guess I'm just not picky enough, but I find people who keep ranting on small details to be really annoying. Looking forward to the Nina arc, that'll be the real challenge for the producers: seeing FMA1-Ed hit Tucker a dozen times still gives me chills.

One more thing: sorry for being repetitive, but I posted that several pages before, and no one seemed to notice, but the reason why Rose and other Lior citizens have white skin in this anime is because LIOR IS NOT ANYWHERE CLOSE TO ISHBAL IN THE MANGA, so they cannot be related to the ishbalans like they were in previous anime, thank you. To be honest, the new look suits her best.


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PsychoSushi
post Apr 20 2009, 04:54 PM
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I thought this was the best episode so far in terms. The pacing is a lot better than the irst 2 episodes. I think they did this part better than the in the original series. There was no unnecessary scenes like the giant green parrot in the 1st series.

I loved the anguished look on Ed's face when Rose said he could use the stone to revive her mother. And is it just me or is Romi Paku's delivery of Ed's lines getting better and better?

I liked that they made Rose pull the trigger on Ed and Al. It showed how more character in her and it's a good improvement from Manga Rose and Series 1 Rose.

However, I did not like the split screens. I found them too comic book like and irritating. And I was disappointed they did not include Ed transmutating the giant Leto statue.

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Popogeejo
post Apr 20 2009, 05:57 PM
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QUOTE (Hagaren_4ever @ Apr 20 2009, 10:32 PM) *
Seriously, though! I never thought that Rose was ever dark-skinned! Someone enlighten me to the situation at hand. T_T

Did you not watch the first anime?


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Rainshine
post Apr 20 2009, 07:25 PM
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QUOTE
Looking forward to the Nina arc, that'll be the real challenge for the producers: seeing FMA1-Ed hit Tucker a dozen times still gives me chills.

Same here!!

The Nina part of the last anime freaked me out.
I can't wait for this one!! happy.gif


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Trizo
post Apr 21 2009, 05:09 AM
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QUOTE (Anakishi @ Apr 21 2009, 07:48 AM) *
One more thing: sorry for being repetitive, but I posted that several pages before, and no one seemed to notice, but the reason why Rose and other Lior citizens have white skin in this anime is because LIOR IS NOT ANYWHERE CLOSE TO ISHBAL IN THE MANGA, so they cannot be related to the ishbalans like they were in previous anime, thank you. To be honest, the new look suits her best.

biggrin.gif I noticed you. And I think that's a really smart point - I completely forgot about the surroundings of Lior in the manga, so naturally like 95% of this board Rose's skin was a bit of a shock to me... Do I like it? Hrmmmm yes. It makes sense that as a nation that obviously isn't into multiculturalism Rose would have to be white and uhm, less Mary-sue


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Kyelinn
post Apr 21 2009, 08:08 AM
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QUOTE (Trizo @ Apr 21 2009, 07:09 AM) *
Do I like it? Hrmmmm yes. It makes sense that as a nation that obviously isn't into multiculturalism Rose would have to be white and uhm, less Mary-sue


*snorts* laugh.gif You took the words right out of my mouth! xD I absolutely loved the Rose in this episode and I look forward to seeing her in the future episodes especially when she meets Winry! At least we know Rose isn't going to be turned into a mute Mary-sue. I seriously could not STAND Rose in the FMA1. I loved how Rose was portrayed in this episode and I love Manga!Rose, so no doubt I'm going to enjoy her character in this series. biggrin.gif


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mewtant307k
post Apr 21 2009, 12:45 PM
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The hot topic for this episode seems to be Rose's skin color. Seriously?

Well, it wasn't as bad as the last episode...but that's no great feat. Still too fast paced (did anyone else think that Rose's character was kind of flattened?) but at least theres hope.

Animation was pretty good, voice actors were great (gluttony, yeah, will take a bit of getting used to) and I personally love the overdramatic orchestral music. But meh, i still favor the old anime's and manga's portrayal of this story arc.

also CORNELLO SMASSHHH was the only bit of (unintentional?) humor that made me laugh. Really damn funny.

Overall, 3/5 ish? I dunno, my expectations are still really low from the last sin against god episode, so I might be being too generous.
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