HAGANE NO RENKINJUTSUSHI
HAGANE NO RENKINJUTSUSHI
full metal alchemist
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Chapter 78 "Regular" Discussion Thread For First Time Readers (and Others), No future chapter spoilers here, please. :)
Anyarel
post Dec 12 2007, 03:13 AM
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Grrrr, why do we have to see Rose instead of my little cute Ed?!

I hate Rose, I hope she'll die soon! xD

Yet this chapter seems interesting and we'll see Roy! smile.gif

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Fushi
post Dec 12 2007, 03:15 AM
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So I come in this thread to have a random peak like I sometimes do and now you guys have reopened my fear that the FMA manga will end like Rozen Maiden did! D:

Seriously, if FMA ends rushed like RM I am comtemplating seppuku. If it ends on a BLOODY SHOT OF A DOOR you will find a dead Fushi by morning.


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Chiisana
post Dec 12 2007, 04:13 AM
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Ehh? Rose will appear in this chapter? biggrin.gif Yaaaaay~!!! -Chiisana ish happy- Can't wait for the scan happy.gif


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Alchemical
post Dec 12 2007, 05:34 AM
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Still no RAW? ;.; *dies* I hope it's out by the time I get back home today.

Hm, I don't like the pace FMA's taking, either. I KNOW it won't end by 80; I don't think Arakawa would take that sort of risk, and end so quickly. I think it has a bit more after 80. But that bit won't be much if it keeps this pace. Perhaps it'll slow down with this chapter?
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AA battery
post Dec 12 2007, 05:50 AM
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QUOTE(Anyarel @ Dec 12 2007, 02:13 AM) *
Grrrr, why do we have to see Rose instead of my little cute Ed?!

I hate Rose, I hope she'll die soon! xD

Yet this chapter seems interesting and we'll see Roy! smile.gif


o_O How could you hate Roze when she only made appearance in chapter 1 and 2? We know too little about her to actually hate her... isn't it completely normal for any human being to wish for their lover to be resurrected? It's the same w/ Ed and Al, wishing for their mom to come back...

Anime!Roze is NOT the same as Manga!Roze. Don't mix them up.
argh Guess I won't get to read the chapter before my next final exam which is in 3 hours...


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Chiyo
post Dec 12 2007, 06:20 AM
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I don't think Rose will be in it much, like she's just a connection for now, she hasn't taken enough of a role beforehand.

I can't take this all in till I see it in full form, too much going on.


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Anyarel
post Dec 12 2007, 06:47 AM
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QUOTE(AA battery @ Dec 12 2007, 01:50 PM) *
QUOTE(Anyarel @ Dec 12 2007, 02:13 AM) *
Grrrr, why do we have to see Rose instead of my little cute Ed?!

I hate Rose, I hope she'll die soon! xD

Yet this chapter seems interesting and we'll see Roy! smile.gif


o_O How could you hate Roze when she only made appearance in chapter 1 and 2? We know too little about her to actually hate her... isn't it completely normal for any human being to wish for their lover to be resurrected? It's the same w/ Ed and Al, wishing for their mom to come back...

Anime!Roze is NOT the same as Manga!Roze. Don't mix them up.
argh Guess I won't get to read the chapter before my next final exam which is in 3 hours...


Actually, I hate her more in the anime than in the manga but in both cases, I think she's too stupid at the beginning of the story. She reminds me of the people in Middle Age who were blinded by their religion. I just hope that now that she appeared again in the manga, she won't be an important character like in the anime. ^^
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Animeoldtimer
post Dec 12 2007, 08:41 AM
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rolleyes.gif Being bored at seeing no signs of the raw, I thought I'd post a comment about the cover. In the picture where Ed and Al are eating pie, is Ed eating with his right hand or left?? I've tried enlarging the picture, but it just becomes more distorted.


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paca
post Dec 12 2007, 08:41 AM
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Thanks for the links and summary!! laugh.gif
I am really looking forward to seeing the RAW!!!

Here I found another summary..(not to be translated, but maybe there is some interesting line _)
第78話「七つの罪」を読んでの感想です
ネタばれ鋼の錬金術師第78話


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Edamame
post Dec 12 2007, 08:54 AM
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QUOTE(Animeoldtimer @ Dec 12 2007, 03:41 PM) *
rolleyes.gif Being bored at seeing no signs of the raw, I thought I'd post a comment about the cover. In the picture where Ed and Al are eating pie, is Ed eating with his right hand or left?? I've tried enlarging the picture, but it just becomes more distorted.


I tried enlarging is as well, and I believe that he is eating the pie with his left arm. The perspective is kind of funny, but I thought that he was turned to the side. (Foreshadowing much.., rolleyes.gif)


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His Name is Unkn...
post Dec 12 2007, 10:02 AM
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QUOTE
Actually, I hate her more in the anime than in the manga but in both cases, I think she's too stupid at the beginning of the story. She reminds me of the people in Middle Age who were blinded by their religion.


You really don't like Rose? Huh...

She's always been one of my favorite characters, both in the anime and manga for the very same reasons you mention for disliking her.

I never viewed her as stupid, but rather innocent albeit naive.

I see nothing wrong with being innocent; in fact, I would find it preferable if more individuals were of such a mind-set. There are too many jaded people in the world today - it's depressing.

Her realization of how she had been manipulated by the people she trusted most was a very powerful moment in both anime and manga. I hope that, as in the anime, she is given a moment to show she has found her own path and something to believe in.

And concerning your comment on religion and the Middle Ages:

People in the Middle Ages weren't blinded by their religion, per se. Rather, they were blinded by ignorance of what the Bible actually said. Catholic tradition at that point dictated that all masses were to be read from the Vulgate (Latin) translation of the Bible by Jerome. Unfortunately, most of the common people had no understanding of Latin and so the masses became more ritual than actual worship.

One of the few recourses for actual Biblical knowledge that an illiterate peasant would have had in the Middle Ages would have been the limited understanding he/she could glean from the storybook depictions of Biblical events on stained glass windows.

The whole purpose of the Reformation, initiated by Martin Luther in 1517 with his 95 Theses was to bring the church back to the authority of scripture over the authority of church tradition. Hence Luther's two defining mottos came to be sola scriptura (scripture alone) and sola fide (faith alone - emphasizing the importance of salvation by faith rather than salvation through good works, a mindset emphasized by the Catholic Church's heresy of indulgences).

The great irony in all of this is that Jerome originally translated the Bible out of the Greek, Hebrew, and Aramaic so that the common man could read and understand its truths (hence the latin Vulgate, meaning vulgar or common). This translation was then used by the church to perpetuate the same kind of ignorance which Jerome worked so hard to combat!
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nick fury
post Dec 12 2007, 10:21 AM
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I often wonder if the peasants and common folk back then were taught to read if things would've been any different. The church found a way or rather was forced to become everything to everyone. When Rome fell there was a vacuum created which the church could only fill. There was no longer a local roman magistrate to enforce laws, or to interprete written law. Priests were the only local people educated enough to preside over local matters. It really wasn't a broad church conspiracy to create illiterate masses that would blindly follow but more of an wealthy organized and educated body of people who saw an opportunity and seized it. Clearly the actions of the Church during this time was less than "Christian" or christ like, but the churches actions were more of a response to the times than it was the creators or the condition of the times. Also the Catholic Church had already modeled itself and it's hierarchy after the Roman empire so it was an easy transition for the masses to accept. The masses needed to be led and told what to do, please tell us does the goat belong to our village or theirs? Does the land belong to me or my neighbor?
Look at people today, the literate bunch that we are yet we remain ignorant and blindly obedient.
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Kimi-N-Ed
post Dec 12 2007, 10:24 AM
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QUOTE(Animeoldtimer @ Dec 12 2007, 09:41 AM) *
rolleyes.gif Being bored at seeing no signs of the raw, I thought I'd post a comment about the cover. In the picture where Ed and Al are eating pie, is Ed eating with his right hand or left?? I've tried enlarging the picture, but it just becomes more distorted.


hmmmmm to me it looks like the right hand to me ...can I say yay. but before i say yay let's look at the cover lol. To me it looks like the right because if you look closly Ed is like facing Al or so i think thats him and if you turn the same way as him you could see that his left hand or arm is down and he's eating pie with his OMG ohmy.gif right hand lol. cause it looks like the arm is coming from the right side. Cause if it was the left arm would've the arm block like his shirt or something? huh.gif But yea thats my guess.


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No more holding it in
How many years can I pretend
Nothing never goes the way it should
No more sitting in this place
Hoping you might see it my way
Cause I don't think you ever understood
That what I'm looking for are the answers
To why these questions never go away

[Chorus]
I'm so far away
I've been changin' but you'll never see me now
I'm so far away
Now I'm blaming you for everything
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Tombow
post Dec 12 2007, 10:48 AM
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Hmmm, still no raw?! I'm all geared up for the heavy duty translation session (judging from the preview summary.. ^^) and just waiting and waiting... XDD

Meantime, Animeoldtimer's question... I enlarged the cover pic and checked also... XD
The line up of fingers looks like that is his right hand to me. ^^

@Paca - Thanks for the link!! ^^ I checked the site, and it's basically his random thoughts on this month's chapter. He writes something about Ho-ho refusing his "Hohenheim" name because it was a name given by Homunculus, but without direct reference to the raw I don't know if it's in this chapter, or if that's his theory since I haven't read the raw yet.. But, if it's really true and Ho-ho is refusing his name because it's given by Homunculus, then us having been calling him Ho-ho and not using his "real' Hohenheim name (for the wrong reason XDD) is justified!!! laugh.gif


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His Name is Unkn...
post Dec 12 2007, 10:59 AM
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To Nick...

I agree with everything you said. I think it would be foolish to ignore the political/economic roles which the church filled after the fall of Rome. And as to whether or not literacy would have solved the problem, that is difficult to say.

The Reformation certainly had a profound and lasting effect on the course of Christianity (in my opinion, for the better), but that was a different time. We are all shaped to some extend by where and when we live, but I do think we are capable of rising above that with adequate education and disciplined self-examination. It's not easy though, that's for sure.

This among other reasons, is why I am sympathetic to a character like Rose. Being raised in a more overtly religious setting has something to do with this, because I have experienced first hand the harmful effects an overly developed religious sense and an underdeveloped intellect can have on people.

Taking advantage of someone's spiritual life and deeply-held beliefs for material gain strikes a chord with me, so whenever I see such a character in a story, I always root for them.

Anyway...

Concerning the summary - I, for one, do not mind the accelerated pace, so long as it is not indicative of a rushed ending. If Arakawa is just building momentum to the outbreak of the final conflict, that's fine. I actually enjoy the change of pace after the deliberation of the past several volumes. As long as we get a close look at all the major showdowns that need to take place (Kimbly vs. Scar, Mustang vs. Envy, Armstrong vs. Fuhrer, Hohenheim vs. Father, etc.) I will be perfectly happy. Also, I'm hoping for an extended conclusion ala the Return of the King. Such an epic and involved story as FMA demands full closure.

I like that Liore is being featured again. Thought it was a nice way to bring things full circle in the anime, and my sentiments haven't changed for the manga. The underground lair in Cornelo's church being a part of Sloth's tunneling operation was a nice touch. Also, the forbidden fountain sounds suspiciously like the fountain of red water that Mugiar was researching in the anime. Yet more parallels emerge.

The face-off between Father and Hohenheim sounds awesome, and it is really making me thing that Selim is somehow possessed rather than actually Pride. In fact, I'd say their dialogue all but confirms it - but that's just me.

Great to see Mustang's gang getting some more page-time. They've been missed as of late. It really looks like we're in for an epic military face off. I'm thinking CoS, sans Nazis. And if Roy loses an eye somewhere along the way I wouldn't be suprised in the least.

Can't wait for the raw!
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