HAGANE NO RENKINJUTSUSHI
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Discussions On "story" On Fma-1, Comparing To Manga Storyline., Your opinions?
adamclark
post Jul 27 2005, 02:35 PM
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Okay, so I've watched the entire series (season one on adultswim and season two via online) and noticed the radical change in direction the series takes in season two. If you don't realize that, then think of the crazy ending the series has.

Then I've read the intro one of the original production managers wrote for the latest dvd volume released yesterday. He said that the anime series ran ahead of the actual manga, and the second half WAS NOT written by Hiromu, but by their story editor.

He also went on to say that they really went crazy in fabricating the second season ("writing to his heart's content" is roughly what he said).


So this got me thinking. If they disregarded the story written by the original author, then that could explain why the second season seems so convoluted and bizarre. (And if you don't agree, just think of the crazy ideas introduced in the 2nd season: Dante and Hoenhim and their "immortality," the gate and what's on the other side, Scar and his plunge into instanity, the philosopher stone becoming real, and the fates of the Elrich boys, are all very new and were not hinted at in the first season.)

Now it will be a VERY long time before the manga is fully released in American, so I dont know if Hiromu wrote a different ending, but what do you think? I think they did a very wrong thing in writing the second half.


okay did i stir enough of you up?


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YoshiCat1
post Jul 27 2005, 03:22 PM
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Arguements can be fun if everyone supports their reasoning. ^-^

Now, I love both the manga and the anime, which I have seen the whole anime and read all the manga scanlations up to this point. It seems obvious where the point is in which the manga and the anime differ greatly. Personally, I loved season 2 of the anime. That's what made me love the series! I think it was a little strange the way things worked in the second season, but I thought it was well thought out and made the series a WHOLE lot better. I don't like cliche endings where the characters have their happy endings, and though the ending was sad and unexpected, it made room for you to continue their stories. (But that gets into the movie and I don't want to spoil myself tongue.gif ) I loved the ending, even if it was ironic in a way. I guess I like anime that has unexpected plot twists and makes you cry even. (Hey! I cried!)

And, even if Arakawa-sensei didn't do the second season, her manga has been just as good, just different. Guess I love FMA all around. rolleyes.gif

But the answer is no! I don't think they made a big mistake! And the reason they changed the second season is because they were releasing the manga at the same time as the series in Japan and they needed different stories.
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Guest_Guest_*
post Jul 27 2005, 06:54 PM
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Actually Hiromu Arakawa had no hand in the anime. The anime's scriptwriter only used her manga as a reference for the first half of the anime(and a bit for the second). The anime's story is controlled by BONES' staff. Yes, it is a big mistake of BONES in my opinion since it diverted greatly from the original spirit of FMA, turning it into a stupid illogical weepy soapfest. They could have came up with another better adapted storyline than the one shown.
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adamclark
post Jul 28 2005, 10:59 AM
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that was my thought.

Personally I like most of season two. The thing I could not handle the most, though, was the parallel worlds. Being used to crappy sci-fi shows in america, I was disappointed to see such a cliched element brought into FMA, especially since it was so out of the blue. it was never refered to in the series.

My beef is with mostly the last two episodes, when all the crap hits the fan. Beyond that it was apparent that there were some continuity issues with season two and season one.

For instance, in an early episode, Envy says he doesn't remember what his original form was, yet in the end he not only knows it, but remembers his history. And that is just one little one (although I admit there are not a lot of continuity problems).

I am hoping everything is resolved in the movie, but am not completely optimistic. I'll just have to wait about year before i get to see it!


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TheVileOne
post Aug 3 2005, 10:02 PM
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Whatever. I like that they went in a different direction. It just makes our reading and enjoyment of the manga that much better. We know its going to end differently, so I want to see how they do it.

The guys who did the series had to do it that way since they couldn't wait for Arakawa-san to finish the manga. Same thing for Trigun, which Nightow didn't even finish. And I still think the Trigun anime is superior to the manga.

With the Fullmetal Alchemist series and movie, we have one complete brilliant piece of work, I like it that way.


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Reika
post Aug 4 2005, 12:56 AM
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I knew they did the second part of the series without any kind of help or refference from Arakawa (except Kimbley) and stuff because there are too much changes. Not just in storyline, but in personalities too.

For instance, Roy suddenly starts to act like he was the father of Edward. He's always been worried about him (and it's more shown in the manga than the anime) but he started acting more like that, and much less "hey, chibi" on the other half. Also, I noticed they centered the story more in the relationship of the brothers and their father (making their father as if he wasn't bad, but someone that admited he was wrong and loved their children, dadicating him just a few episodes) and the Ishbal war (now repeting on Lior) than in finding a way to change their bodies back, homunculus propose etc.

What I didn't like about this other half is the fact that they needed to add characters that shouldn't be there, I mean, 2ndary characters that showed their face in the first episodes and didn't have anything important to do but show the beginning, in order to be able to continue and give an ending: Roze, Lyla etc.

I didn't like either the Roze/Ed that there's in the last episodes. Specially in the last 2. When Dante said "I understand why he fell for you" I was like "huh???!", and when Ed seems so important to her, as if they were really in love I was like "when did that happen??? when Ed tried to convince her her boyfriend wasn't going to live never again and she looked at him with hate and pain? Or when Roze said that she didn't understand him when he said she needed to keep walking??".

I recall BONES saying "We may not make Winry appear in the movie because she didn't give much to the anime", and I was like "WTF?!", because THEY did make more important Roze in the last episodes, adding Ed/Roze, while they could have change that and add more protagonism to Winry, and more Winry/Ed.

Another idea that,for me, could have been better was the idea of Roy having killed winry's parents. This idea isn't from the other half, but from before, but what bothers me is in the other half, I think the idea itself was good. Episode 43: Winry's continuesly looking bad at Roy, with pain in her eyes and asks him "Answear me! Is this the same as when you killed my parents?!", we are continuesly seeing how she's worried about Ed and how she links that to their parents. (Same impression gave me Shiezska with her continous "and what if you discover anything? (Episode 44)" and "You don't care about anything but raising in the military"), but then in episode 44: Shiezska "I've been all this time wrong about him, I thought he didn't care about Hughes" Winry "I will become... the most respected man of this country. He promised that. that's why he can't do anything with the hatred impulse. He's an adult". And I ask "When did we see that radical change of actitude?

Same happens with Ed and Roy, I think their relationship's always been "you are starting to really annoy me~" but there's a way between that and "I hate him to death", which doesn't seem as hard as that when you see how they treat each other in other episodes but 44. It really surprised me and I couldn't agree with that.

And there are some more things, not to say the mistakes they made, forgetting some things, and holes (which I'll state in another thread ("Do you hate what BONES did to FMA?"), that make me don't like this other half.

(But what really really bothers me is that they said they would show things in the movie they don't show!!!!! >.<)

In conclusion, what's for me this other half of the series?: I think it's a poor written script, with some good ideas that could have been better developed. They tried to add too much drama without considering some important facts and made it seem rushed because of that and the continuous trying to surprise us in just 25 episodes, making it look as if they took it out under their sleeve in one moment as they were making the animation.
Also, after reading the manga, it gives me the feeling that they tried to end something that was just the beginning, and that they couldn't make a really deep plot in this other half, forgetting the storiline of the first half and leaving it aside and having the need to put secondary characters instead of original ones with their own story.

My personal opinion is that they could have made a stop in the series of a year and then continue with the anime with the manga as support. Or at least consult Arakawa more often, although I have an omake where she said "You are the ones releasing this, not me".


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Red Shadow
post Sep 23 2005, 03:58 PM
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The anime has a lot of continutity problems, I'm not contesting that all. And the story was weak in a few spots, but it gave us something to look after, concepts to argue about, to develop on our own. And let's not forget that Arakawa-san has yet to finish her masterpiece, which is what we're all really after anyways. And that she already has the ending all planned out, though she hasn't revealed it to us yet.


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Antimony
post Sep 23 2005, 07:49 PM
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After reading all the online mangas and spoilers of the anime series at my disposal, I must admit that I like the manga much better. It really seems much more coherent as a whole and exists as a world of its own. It's a completely alternate reality you can immerse yourself in, but the anime's connection to our mundane reality breaks the illusion and reminds you that none of what you're watching it actually real. Another problem I have with the anime is that the focus is mainly on Edward. I know he's the main character and his name is in the title, but he just wouldn't be Ed without Al. And though he's an important character Alphonse tends to have a more passive role then his loud, confident brother. The manga is like this too but isn't quite the same. Al is definitely gaining more confidence in himself and his alchemy skills are improving. He often takes charge when Ed isn't around, and in one funny scene Ed worries that Al is surpassing him! Speaking of characters, although there have been some new ones brought in they don't take too much attention away from the main cast. Arakawa-sensei takes time to develop the new guys but does not forget the major characters and their relationships. Maybe once I actually watch all the anime episodes I'll come to appreciate as a separate story in itself, but for the time being i find the manga to be superior in quality and content.


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Pamster
post Sep 24 2005, 09:37 PM
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QUOTE(TheVileOne @ Aug 4 2005, 01:02 AM) [snapback]240014[/snapback]

Whatever. I like that they went in a different direction. It just makes our reading and enjoyment of the manga that much better. We know its going to end differently, so I want to see how they do it.

The guys who did the series had to do it that way since they couldn't wait for Arakawa-san to finish the manga. Same thing for Trigun, which Nightow didn't even finish. And I still think the Trigun anime is superior to the manga.

With the Fullmetal Alchemist series and movie, we have one complete brilliant piece of work, I like it that way.


I totally agree with this TheVileOne. I like that they went in a different direction. Like just look at some of the differences and the manga comes out as being the more in depth emotionally. That last line in particular, now having seen the movie I have to say, "With the Fullmetal Alchemist series and movie, we have one complete brilliant piece of work, I like it that way." I like it that way indeed.

QUOTE(Antimony @ Sep 23 2005, 10:49 PM) [snapback]291361[/snapback]

After reading all the online mangas and spoilers of the anime series at my disposal, I must admit that I like the manga much better. It really seems much more coherent as a whole and exists as a world of its own. It's a completely alternate reality you can immerse yourself in, but the anime's connection to our mundane reality breaks the illusion and reminds you that none of what you're watching it actually real. Another problem I have with the anime is that the focus is mainly on Edward. I know he's the main character and his name is in the title, but he just wouldn't be Ed without Al. And though he's an important character Alphonse tends to have a more passive role then his loud, confident brother. The manga is like this too but isn't quite the same. Al is definitely gaining more confidence in himself and his alchemy skills are improving. He often takes charge when Ed isn't around, and in one funny scene Ed worries that Al is surpassing him! Speaking of characters, although there have been some new ones brought in they don't take too much attention away from the main cast. Arakawa-sensei takes time to develop the new guys but does not forget the major characters and their relationships. Maybe once I actually watch all the anime episodes I'll come to appreciate as a separate story in itself, but for the time being i find the manga to be superior in quality and content.


I agree with you too especially about the focus being more on Ed in the anime, he needs Al, he is his reason for living and breathing. You put it nicely about how manga Al is different then in the anime was something I identified with just from the manga of it I've read. I've seen all eps and spoiled myself by seeing the movie too. Increidble stuff FMA. Will need to start collecting the manga. Great reply, thought you should know someone agreed with you. biggrin.gif
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Antimony
post Sep 25 2005, 08:51 PM
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Thanks, Pamster! smile.gif


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Reika
post Sep 26 2005, 08:52 AM
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I agree with you Antimony. I think they tried to make us, the audience, so into the story and conected with the characters on them that they had to "break the fantasy" and invented the london idea, made Ed and Al stay in our world, etc.


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Antimony
post Sep 29 2005, 05:28 PM
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I just discovered this review of the FMA anime which points out a lot of continuity problems and compares it to the manga. It's an interesting read if you don't mind all the profanity. tongue.gif

Rossman Ratings and Reviews


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Pamster
post Sep 30 2005, 04:55 PM
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WHOA talk about profanity! You weren't kidding Antimony! But all in all it was a good read. I get the jist that they didn't like the second half of the series and that's cool. I just wish they (Bones) had not gone with the alter world beyond the gate thing. But I guess by then they had thoughts on the movie in mind maybe? Who knows. Interesting read I'll say that much. LOL! wink.gif
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TheVileOne
post Sep 30 2005, 05:37 PM
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QUOTE(Antimony @ Sep 30 2005, 12:28 AM) [snapback]294304[/snapback]

I just discovered this review of the FMA anime which points out a lot of continuity problems and compares it to the manga. It's an interesting read if you don't mind all the profanity. tongue.gif

Rossman Ratings and Reviews


I read it. Just more bitter and nonsensical whining to me.

They just can't accept any changes or deviation from the manga. So they must hate Trigun as well which is vastly different from Nightow's manga in many places.


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Antimony
post Sep 30 2005, 07:33 PM
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I don't think they were complaining about how the anime was different from the manga, it was because the storytelling in the anime was inconsistent. And I don't know if they've seen Trigun or not since there's no review for it on the site.


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